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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 1 Sep 2001 18:05:53 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Nancy Smith <nsmith@NEGIA.NET>
Subject:      Re: Psyche in Cyberspace and haiku also
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Hi folks,  My page is finally up on the World Haiku Association site, if any
of you want to 'seek a peak'.

    Nancy

http://www.epiphanous.org/wha/eng/us/n.smith.shtml

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=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 13 Sep 2001 21:55:23 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Janell Adair <jfadair9@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Attack on US
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hello Everyone:


         I'm sitting at my computer, comfortable in my home, in Pennsylvania
midway between New York City and Washington D.C. wondering how others in the
world feel about what happened in those cities on Tuesday of this week.

         My mind has a difficult time comprehending the horror and the
brutality of what's happened and I try to understand why, but in all cases I
fail. So many innocent people have lost their lives and the question I ask
is: "for what reason"?  Nothing any terrorist could say or any believer in a
fervent cause could offer would justify, in my mind, such brutality and lack
of humanity.

        Peace and love.


         Janell

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=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 13 Sep 2001 22:56:34 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <PumpknSoul@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US
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Peace and love to you too, Janell, and to everyone else -

I had surgery the day of the attacks and the surreality has seemed to in some
ways exaggerated.  One surreal aspect is that there has been no Psyber-L
communication that I have seen, and I think why not?

Aren't we, don't we in some aspects represent the soul, or the exploration of
the soul, of the world?  Or is my conception of Psyber-L different than the
rest of yours?

On the pragmatic side, Janell, in answer to your question "for what reason",
I was in love with a Kuwaiti when I was in college in the late '60's.  I
probably can't express this very well, except to say that there was a fiber
in his being, in his friends from other Arabic countries beings, that was
unlike any American's I've ever known - a single mindness determination and a
hate that burned intensely and outwardly.  And it is frightening that we in
Western culture seem to be so unaware of that quality other persons possess.

My grief at this time is like the sharp edge of a needle.  I wonder how the
rest of you feel and experience this.

With love
Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 14 Sep 2001 18:35:27 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Attack on US
In-Reply-To:  <12a.44e170e.28d2cbe2@aol.com>
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Sheryl, Janell, friends,

Yes - Peace and love to you too.  I am glad you have written.  I
began a post on the day of the attack and wrote the words shock
and horror... and then could write no more as the day unfolded
without space for me to be here in this group.

My condolences to those who have been affected directly by this
event.

This event leaves me still in shock and with sadness and anger.
I have been counselling each day and of course the theme occurs
in almost every session.  People can quickly relate the terrorist
dynamics to events in their own life - events of personal terror.
makes me see that there are daily events of invisible terror all
the while.  What a difficult place the world can be.

Kate and I grapple with life changes (for example on the day of
the attack I had an offer accepted that i made on a new place for
us to live).  This of course involves the grief of leaving our
old villa, and the stress of making decisions about selling or
renting it out.  A lucky luxury to have such stress!  We have
been saying to each other we are grateful to be alive and have
each other.

The attacks on the US have opened me up to deeper feelings... to
feeling more deeply.  Today hearing that they sang the American
anthem at the Changing of the Guard in London made me tearful.  I
was moved by the respect and the opportunity for public
expression for grief.

May goodwill prevail!


Walter

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 14 Sep 2001 17:19:14 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Nancy Smith <nsmith@NEGIA.NET>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from New Zealand
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Hello All,
    I thought some of you might be interested in this email from my niece in
Wellington, NZ.  In truth it is a small world.
        Nancy

>> Will be saying this prayer in a joint Anglican/Presbyterian service that
Embassy personnel were invited to join in, tomorrow in downtown Wellington.
People here feel for us very deeply.  Our house is full of cards and
flowers--I can tell the sense of helplessness brings people to shower us
with these attentions, it is very touching.

Loving God,
You know why we are here.  We are mourning the loss of innocent lives.  This
time those killed were in America, and we lift them up to you, along with
their families.  These lives have been torn from us.  Expectations the years
once held have vanished.  The blood of the murdered cries out from the
ground, as it has again and again in human history, ever since Cain killed
Abel.  And we come to you again with our sorrow and our despair, because you
are a God who knows sorrow, and understands despair.  Lord, the violence of
humankind, who you created in your image, is always with us.  How well you
know that violence, you who died on a cross.
            Yet, O God, you know more than our violence and despair.  You
know how to bring freedom to a nation of slaves, comfort to the bereaved,
even salvation through crucifixion.  So we also come to you with our hope.
We have hope for the dead.  Firemen and airplane crews gave their lives in
ways we do not yet understand, but you do.  Thousands died, and now we
entrust their souls to you.  We have hope for the living.  We ask your
protection for those still involved in rescue efforts in shaky buildings. We
have hope for the bereaved.  We ask your comfort for them, and for the many
who are frightened, both in the U.S. and around the world.  We have hope for
the future.  We ask your guidance for President Bush and other world
leaders.  Father, may this be an occasion when the voices of justice and
mercy are heard.  We don't know how the perpetrators of these crimes may be
found, but we ask your guidance in preventing the spilling of more innocent
blood.  We have hope for solidarity among those who believe in democracy.
Please make this a time when the world can act together to not only cry out
against violence, but reach out to shelter those who suffer from it--whether
they are Christian victims of violence in the U.S., or Muslim refugees in
the Pacific.  And we beg that you will not allow these heinous acts
committed in the U.S. to separate citizens of different cultures who live
together.  In societies like America's and New Zealand's, may Christian and
Muslim, Hindu and Jew, Pakeha and Maori continue to grow closer to one
another.
          One of the hardest things for us to understand, Lord, is the
dedication to carrying out acts of sheer hatred that the terrorists must
have had, in order to deliberately kill themselves and so many thousands of
innocent civilians.  God of love, give us that much dedication to healing
the wounds of the world.  Give us that much courage to reach out to those
who are different from ourselves, before such habits of hate become
entrenched.  And where those habits are already entrenched, give us the
super-human strength, strength that can only come from you, to reach beyond
revenge into reconciliation.  For the families and friends of those who have
died, we beg for your peace, that peace that passes understanding.  And we
ask for that peace in our own lives, even though it is not an easy thing to
be peacemakers.  Help us to accept that challenge wherever we go, and
whatever we do.  We pray these things in the name of Jesus Christ, our
revolutionary leader who refused to be a terrorist.   Amen.<<

>

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 13:22:14 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from New Zealand
In-Reply-To:  <004801c13d7c$0ddb4f00$2b0e1ed0@default>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Nancy

> And we beg that you will not allow these heinous acts
> committed in the U.S. to separate citizens of different cultures who live
> together.  In societies like America's and New Zealand's, may Christian and
> Muslim, Hindu and Jew, Pakeha and Maori continue to grow closer to one
> another.

This sentiment is strongly in my mind as i hear of brutal and
racist attacks in the aftermath.

I fear war.  The word war has been used to describe the attacks
and also the anticipated response. The perpetrators who are still
alive need to be found and punished, that is justice not war.

~~~

My thoughts go to you Stephen... you are a person in Islam.  I
hope that you can be here in psyber-l now and in the times to
come.

Walter

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 14 Sep 2001 18:27:24 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Aldon Hynes <ahynes1@YAHOO.COM>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from New Zealand
In-Reply-To:  <e795qtknsuu0j24e9905l8bg494crqpdcm@4ax.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Some thoughts I posted on a different list...

As my wife and I were leaving the living room and
getting ready to sit down and eat, our neighbors came
by.  It was 7 PM, and they were bearing candles.  We
lit our candles from theirs and stood on the porch and
talked for a while.

Our neighbor across the street works for Morgan
Stanley.  He got home okay from the World Trade
Centers.  Another neighbor was stranded in Chicago and
drove back safely.  We talked about our anger and our
sadness.

While I worry greatly about the jingoism that I hear
some people spouting and I hope we are very reticent
about any retaliation or escalation, I am glad to be
one praying for peace and justice, lighting my candles
and flying my flags.

It is my hope that we can transcend merely stamping
out terrorism, and instead focus on the hate and
injustice that breeds terrorism.  It is my hope that
we can own our anger and our sadness and use it
constructively.

Aldon

__________________________________________________
Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help?
Donate cash, emergency relief information
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 14 Sep 2001 22:18:21 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Janell Adair <jfadair9@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from New Zealand
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Walter, Nancy and All:


        I agree with you Walter and with Nancy also that the terrorism must
NOT bring about brutal or racist attacks, if it did then the terrorists'
would succeed, and I don't personally feel they will.

        I additionally agree that we need to find and punish the
perpetrators and that is justice, but we must not sink into war, that is
something that is much different.

       I also pray that everyone regardless of their religious or non
religious beliefs feels comfortable and is welcome here otherwise Psber-L
would not be what I believe it is.


      Peace and Love.

            Janell


----- Original Message -----
From: "Walter Logeman" <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
To: <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:22 PM
Subject: Re: [P] Attack on US/ Prayer from New Zealand


> Nancy
>
> > And we beg that you will not allow these heinous acts
> > committed in the U.S. to separate citizens of different cultures who
live
> > together.  In societies like America's and New Zealand's, may Christian
and
> > Muslim, Hindu and Jew, Pakeha and Maori continue to grow closer to one
> > another.
>
> This sentiment is strongly in my mind as i hear of brutal and
> racist attacks in the aftermath.
>
> I fear war.  The word war has been used to describe the attacks
> and also the anticipated response. The perpetrators who are still
> alive need to be found and punished, that is justice not war.
>
> ~~~
>
> My thoughts go to you Stephen... you are a person in Islam.  I
> hope that you can be here in psyber-l now and in the times to
> come.
>
> Walter
>

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 16:07:13 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from New Zealand
In-Reply-To:  <03fc01c13d8c$b2996e40$f75279a5@janellad>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Janell

> I additionally agree that we need to find and punish the
> perpetrators and that is justice, but we must not sink into war, that is
> something that is much different.

That is good for me to hear - i see this as vital - though there
is a lot of debate about what war is and has become.  War is
grand scale crime and destruction but not all grand scale crime
and destruction is war.  I am still shaken by the tragedy - and
over that now feel scared of retaliation.

This morning the NZ prime minister was quoted as supporting the
US & Bush in any steps it might take - but has retracted - good
to see.  details below.


Walter


~~~

== PM Backs Away From Conflict Support ==
IRN

Prime Minister Helen Clark is backing away from declaring that
New Zealand will support the United States in any armed conflict,
following this week's terrorist attacks in America.

US President George W Bush has been seeking diplomatic backing
for retaliation after Wednesday's attacks on Washington and New
York.

Helen Clark says the Government is prepared to support the UN
Security Council Resolution, calling on all nations to fight
terrorism.

But she is reluctant to commit the Government's backing for war.

Miss Clark also says New Zealand has strong intelligence ties
with the US, and will continue to maintain those ties.
.
But she is also fearful of an overreaction.

President George W Bush is rallying diplomatic support for a
reprisal attack, but Ms Clark says if the US moves on Afghanistan
believing terrorist Osama bin Laden is in hiding there, many
innocent lives may be lost.

She says a move like that would destroy the moral high ground.

But Miss Clark stresses New Zealand is prepared to fulfil its
international obligations.



Bulletin supplied by IRN Limited Copyright 2001 IRN Limited. All
copyright in this bulletin remains the property of IRN Limited.
Terms and Conditions.

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 01:59:15 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      possibility and reality
In-Reply-To:  <e795qtknsuu0j24e9905l8bg494crqpdcm@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Walter, all,

>My thoughts go to you Stephen... you are a person in Islam.  I
>hope that you can be here in psyber-l now and in the times to
>come.

Walter, I am always here. Although I believe I've made this distinction
here before, and, in fact you name my status correctly, I remind my friends
here that I am not a Muslim. Islam means surrender. But, means so to only
the Muslim? How could only Muslims surrender?

So, I seek sincerely, May God Will it so.

(That said, the roots of my goal was/is my encounter with Islam. However, I
have zero authority as an outsider in matters of the religion of the
Muslims. Be wary.) If your impression was different, that is my fault;
forgive me. Certainly as a Believer, a person in Islam, I am abject. May
God forgive me.

***

If this seems strange to you now, its more strange than that because
whatever impression anybody here might have, it is more substantial here
than any impression transmitted to and received by most persons near me in
the f2f world, (Judith and a few others excepted). In fact, my spiritual
commitments are a private matter. On the other hand, people -generally-
don't really want to know where the other person is really coming from.

***

I have remained silent on this list and the two others I am devoted too
about the world-shaking matters of the past week. It has been a roller
coaster of feeling and thought and it plunged me into severe introspection.
Nothing of my core commitments to my fellow persons has been altered by
this introspection. In matters of implementation: the only thing left to do
is to do.

***

Does it make sense to suggest today the world is irrevocably changed and
irrevocably in the usual predicament? +The cause of peace will be waged by
its regents for many millenia to come+ a hard truth of, to borrow from the
conception of only the most Noble muslim, *Jihad*.

Walter, my own ignorance and illusions make me very cruel - so the *real*
war for me is crystal clear.

***

11TH HOUR

at my desk / suddenly
. . .in the clear day's

arms

falling
burning
falling

crushed

by every
difference
in the world

Love
begged me

again
and
again
and




***

God knows best. peace,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 08:34:36 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <PumpknSoul@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from Colorado
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
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Walter, all...

I went to sleep last night slightly repulsed with the thought of this and
your other  post Walter... somehow added to slightly by Janell's and Aldon's
posts of pleas for peace.

As I decided to wait until today to respond, I thought that I understood what
Robert wrote not all that long ago, that Psyber-L may now be something other
than what I thought it was, once, and I wonder if I have just held on to my
projection far too long?

Well, I will plunge on, likely to non reponse from the list itself:

In a message dated 01-09-14 21:29:38 EDT, you write:

> This sentiment is strongly in my mind as i hear of brutal and
>  racist attacks in the aftermath.

What?  What brutal and racist attacks do you speak of?  Our media in Denver
has dregged up a couple of spots by Arabic Muslim students, all female, who
have complained of being verbally abused.  Certainly nothing compared to the
loss of 1000s of *regular* folks in the attacks.

Are there instances occuring that are not being exposed to us by the media
here in the US?

>  I fear war.  The word war has been used to describe the attacks
>  and also the anticipated response. The perpetrators who are still
>  alive need to be found and punished, that is justice not war.
>
>  ~~~

I fear living in a world dominated by fear.  I fear relating to people and
places with distrust, that my children and grandchildren will live in that
sort of atmosphere.

I understand what President Bush means when he calls it a war.  It feels like
a war to me, too, against paranoia, distrust, and fear.

>  My thoughts go to you Stephen... you are a person in Islam.  I
>  hope that you can be here in psyber-l now and in the times to
>  come.

Oh Walter.  Rarely have I read something someone I've *known* for such a long
time to write something that would shift my perception of him/her as much as
this statement you made.  My perception of you does seem to have shifted or
has become less fixed anyway... but this statement glared.

I'm at a loss for words.  I was happy to see that Stephen responded though...
I will be rereading his thoughts.

Oh my.  I hope I don't sound too much like a right wing warmonger.  Really, I
still write in peace and love.

Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 10:51:32 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <PumpknSoul@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Islam/Muslim/Spirituality
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Walter-

To help ME understand, could you please explain what you meant in the
following?:

In a message dated 01-09-14 21:29:38 EDT, you write:

> My thoughts go to you Stephen... you are a person in Islam.  I
>  hope that you can be here in psyber-l now and in the times to
>  come.

My impression is that Stephen, who by no means has any need for me to speak
for him (a hilarious thought IMO) has expressed his spirituality in Psyber-L,
with Islam as his path.  I have held his openness about it with honor and
envied him for having clarity in his spiritual path.

I see no connection between the attacks and destruction by the terrorists
against the US with Stephen being a person in Islam.

And so, maybe you can help me out here Walter to understand your meaning.

With hope
Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 08:25:30 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from Colorado
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Here are two early US reports:

Arab-Americans, Muslims threatened; Bush urges public not to take vengeance
By DEBORAH KONG, Associated Press
http://www.nandotimes.com/nation/story/78817p-1102739c.html
FREMONT, Calif. (September 14, 2001 12:15 a.m. EDT) - Tension and fear
continued to plague ethnic and religious minorities Thursday, even as
President Bush urged the public not to take vengeance against Arab-Americans
or Muslims for the terrorist attacks in New York and Washington.
In a neighborhood that is home to about two dozen Afghan-American
businesses, people felt the president needed to extend protection to all the
groups that now feel targeted or under suspicion because of the devastation
in New York and Washington.
Afghan-Americans also "don't have anything to do with this situation," said
Zabi Habashzada as he bought bread in an Afghan market in Fremont, a city
about 35 miles southeast of San Francisco. "They don't have to be blamed for
an action done by some terrorists."
The prime suspect in the terror plot is Saudi-born terror mastermind Osama
bin Laden, who was given asylum by Afghanistan's Taliban rulers. Federal
authorities have also identified more than a dozen hijackers of Middle
Eastern descent in Tuesday's attacks.
The president said Thursday that "we must be mindful ... we treat
Arab-Americans and Muslims with the respect they deserve."
"We should not hold one who is a Muslim responsible for an act of terror,"
Bush said in Washington.
But Homayoun Khamosh, who owns Pamir Food Market in Fremont, said someone
had already thrown rocks and a bottle at his store.
His wife begged him to stay home from work, saying, "Please don't go, maybe
something could happen to you," Khamosh said. But he went and hung a
patriotic banner from his shop window.
"I have to live my life," he said.
At Southern New Hampshire University, a professor and adviser to the Muslim
Student Association warned members of the group to stay close to the campus
in Manchester, N.H.
"Most people are telling me that they are scared," said Mahboubul Hassan,
who also is president of the Islamic Society of Greater Manchester.
Around the country, Arab-Americans, Muslims and others groups - including
Sikhs, who wear turbans and grow beards as a sign of their faith, continued
to report harassment and violence.
Police in Bridgeview, Ill., turned back 300 marchers - some waving American
flags and shouting "USA! USA!" - as they tried to march Wednesday night on a
mosque in the Chicago suburb.
"I'm proud to be American and I hate Arabs and I always have," said
19-year-old Colin Zaremba, who marched with the group.
In Palos Heights, Ill., a man who used the blunt end of a machete to attack
a Moroccan gas station attendant was charged with a hate crime, police said.
And in Huntington, N.Y., a 75-year-old man tried to run over a Pakistani
woman in a shopping mall parking lot, police said. The man followed the
woman into a store and threatened to kill her for "destroying my country,"
authorities said.
Early Thursday, a Molotov cocktail was thrown against the side of the
Islamic Society of Denton, Texas, causing an estimated $2,500 in damage,
said Kiersten Dieterle, a spokeswoman for the Dallas suburb. The building
was empty and there were no injuries.

*

Arab-Americans being targeted as scapegoats
09/14/2001 - Updated 12:42 AM ET
By Patrick O'Driscoll, USA TODAY
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2001/09/13/arab-americans.htm
DENVER -- Amid strong evidence that Islamic radicals carried out Tuesday's
terrorist attacks, a nasty backlash is building against the USA's estimated
7 million Muslims and 6 million Arab-Americans. Shots fired at a mosque in
Texas and Arab businesses in Indiana. Angry marchers and anonymous
bomb-throwers in Chicago. Vandalism at houses of worship and Islamic centers
from Virginia to California. And everywhere, threats, slurs and obscenities.
Authorities hope for some respite on Friday, when America's national day of
prayer for the thousands of victims also coincides with Islam's holiest day
of the week, the traditional Muslim day of communal prayer.
So many hate incidents have been reported this week that "we haven't been
able to keep up with them," says Ibrahim Hooper of the Council on
American-Islamic Relations. The Washington-based advocacy group tallied 200
such incidents in the misdirected anti-terrorist furor immediately after the
Oklahoma City bombing in 1995.
"The atmosphere is very tense for Muslims in this country," Hooper says.
"Inevitably, people will come back to their senses, but we don't know how
much damage and injury will be done in the meantime."
No injuries have been reported, but Muslims and their community centers,
houses of worship and businesses have endured bomb threats, a Molotov
cocktail, graffiti, bullets, obscenities and spitting. Slurs have been
unleashed on-line in Internet chat rooms and on the air on talk-radio shows.
Fearing violence, some families have kept children out of school and a
number of mosques and Islamic academies remain closed.
On Wednesday, the Senate passed a resolution, 98-0, condemning violence and
discrimination against Arab-Americans. Both President Bush and his father,
the former president, called for tolerance. Attorney General John Ashcroft
added: "We must not de-scend to the level of those who perpetrated Tuesday's
violence."
The day of the attacks, a man in a downtown Denver accounting firm
approached the desk of a female co-worker who is Muslim. "I hope you're
happy now," the man told her.
"She was blown away by it," says lawyer Wadi Muhaisen, a Denver native and
spokesman for several Muslim and Arab-American groups here. "As soon as we
saw what happened, we were shocked and saddened. But unlike most Americans,
we had to take another step back and say, 'Oh, no, not again.' "
Muhaisen says Muslim and Arab-Americans "just don't want to be stereotyped
anymore. We want to mourn with our fellow Americans. We are as victimized as
any Ameri-can by what happened."
Still, the hate incidents have been numerous:
Police in a Chicago suburb turned back about 300 noisy marchers late
Wednesday blocks from a mosque. Someone threw a Molotov cocktail at an
Arab-American com-munity center in Chicago, one of half a dozen incidents
under investigation by the city's hate crime unit.
Six bullets broke the windows of a Muslim center in suburban Dallas, and
vandals defaced a mosque in the Virginia suburbs of the nation's capital
with obscene graffiti. In northern Indiana, gunmen shot up Arab-owned gas
stations and damaged a Jordanian restaurant.
In San Francisco, someone left a bag filled with pig's blood on the doorstep
of an Islamic community center. In New York, a man was arrested for an
anti-Arab threat, and an Oregon man was held for a phone threat against a
Muslim center. In Alexandria, Va., bricks shattered the windows of an
Islamic bookstore. A Muslim taxi driver reportedly was chased near his home
in another Virginia suburb. In Alabama, women in traditional Islamic
garments were jeered and spat upon.
But not all calls to mosques and Islamic community centers have been vicious
and hateful. Many offer hope, sympathy and support as well. "Some of these
messages are so emotional that I cannot help myself crying when I listen,"
says Imam Ibrahim Kazerooni, religious head of the Islamic Center of
Ahl-Al-Beit in Denver.
On Thursday, an anonymous woman dropped off flowers at the rust-colored
brick mosque of the Colorado Muslim Society, Denver's largest Islamic
community. "We share the tragedy. It's hurting us also," says Talib Syed,
the society's president.
Still, the mosque was closed on Tuesday and attendance has been down. Across
the street, sheriff's deputies have kept a round-the-clock watch to prevent
incidents.
At his own center, Kazerooni has reduced the normal number of prayer
services and spends less time alone in the building out of security
concerns. He advises the faithful "not to be too visible" so potential
run-ins with angry bigots are minimized. Not surprisingly, no one has
attended noon prayers since the attacks.
Kazerooni says the mistaken outrage against Muslims for the Oklahoma City
bombing, committed by disgruntled white extremist Timothy McVeigh,
"shattered the dream" of Muslim families who thought they'd left
discrimination behind. So this time, he adds, "people are more apprehensive.
If one building in Oklahoma could result in such a back-lash, what will THIS
bring?"

--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Rheingold Associates
http://www.rheingold.com/associates

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 08:27:22 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Attack 02
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

This one is closer to Walter:

Mosque firebombed in Australia
September 14, 2001 Posted: 12:48 AM EDT (0448 GMT)

SYDNEY, Australia (Reuters) -- A mosque was firebombed in Australia
overnight as race hate against Muslims simmered in the aftermath of the
deadly attacks on New York and Washington, police said on Friday.
Police in the eastern state of Queensland said two Molotov cocktails were
thrown at the mosque in the city of Brisbane but there were no injuries and
only minor damage.
Police were looking for a male caucasian who was seen in a car outside the
mosque at the time.
Australian church leaders have appealed for tolerance after suspicions
hardened that Tuesday's terror attacks in the United States may have been
planned by exiled Saudi-born dissident Osama bin Laden, currently sheltered
by Afghanistan's hardline Taliban.
Local Islamic groups have reported that a bus full of Muslim schoolchildren
was stoned in Melbourne, a mosque was smeared with faeces in Western
Australia, Muslim women have had their veils ripped off and anti-Arab
graffiti is appearing.
Australian Muslims also came under attack during the Gulf War in 1991 and in
the immediate aftermath of the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing.

[ more:
http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/auspac/09/13/attack.australia.muslims.
reut/index.html ]

Regards,

--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Rheingold Associates
http://www.rheingold.com/associates



----- Original Message -----
From: "Sheryl Garner" <PumpknSoul@AOL.COM>
To: <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: [P] Attack on US/ Prayer from Colorado


> Walter, all...
>
> I went to sleep last night slightly repulsed with the thought of this and
> your other  post Walter... somehow added to slightly by Janell's and
Aldon's
> posts of pleas for peace.
>
> As I decided to wait until today to respond, I thought that I understood
what
> Robert wrote not all that long ago, that Psyber-L may now be something
other
> than what I thought it was, once, and I wonder if I have just held on to
my
> projection far too long?
>
> Well, I will plunge on, likely to non reponse from the list itself:
>
> In a message dated 01-09-14 21:29:38 EDT, you write:
>
> > This sentiment is strongly in my mind as i hear of brutal and
> >  racist attacks in the aftermath.
>
> What?  What brutal and racist attacks do you speak of?  Our media in
Denver
> has dregged up a couple of spots by Arabic Muslim students, all female,
who
> have complained of being verbally abused.  Certainly nothing compared to
the
> loss of 1000s of *regular* folks in the attacks.
>
> Are there instances occuring that are not being exposed to us by the media
> here in the US?
>
> >  I fear war.  The word war has been used to describe the attacks
> >  and also the anticipated response. The perpetrators who are still
> >  alive need to be found and punished, that is justice not war.
> >
> >  ~~~
>
> I fear living in a world dominated by fear.  I fear relating to people and
> places with distrust, that my children and grandchildren will live in that
> sort of atmosphere.
>
> I understand what President Bush means when he calls it a war.  It feels
like
> a war to me, too, against paranoia, distrust, and fear.
>
> >  My thoughts go to you Stephen... you are a person in Islam.  I
> >  hope that you can be here in psyber-l now and in the times to
> >  come.
>
> Oh Walter.  Rarely have I read something someone I've *known* for such a
long
> time to write something that would shift my perception of him/her as much
as
> this statement you made.  My perception of you does seem to have shifted
or
> has become less fixed anyway... but this statement glared.
>
> I'm at a loss for words.  I was happy to see that Stephen responded
though...
> I will be rereading his thoughts.
>
> Oh my.  I hope I don't sound too much like a right wing warmonger.
Really, I
> still write in peace and love.
>
> Sheryl
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
> here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html
>
>

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 12:03:42 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Islam/Muslim/Spirituality
In-Reply-To:  <5f.1adcc316.28d4c4f4@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Sheryl,

If I were a Muslim, I would have read Walter's note as intending to express
his concern for me and any Muslim who was subjected to being lumped with
the demonic extremists ('Islamicism' is the modern term for the extremist's
beliefs,) and pursuant to the expected outcome of such a gross projection,
as Charles reports, threatened and persecuted. That's how I read it.


I hope I've described my own situation clearly enough. I take complete
responsibility for creating the confusion in the first place; I'm sorry. On
the other hand, I hope my point about the deep impulse of surrender as a
focal point for being in service to the cause of peace is not totally lost
here.

***

Walter may well need to elaborate, but not for my sake.

regards,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 15:09:28 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <PumpknSoul@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from Colorado
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Charles, all...

You provided an impressive report of incidents, which truly does appear to be
a filled out version of the media report I've seen on TV here.  With the
mention of Denver, I have no doubt that these come from the same sources.

That news clip was in some ways similar, I think, to the TV scene of
Palestinians celebrating the attack - which of course was the same clip shown
over and over again, designed to incite many of us in the US.  The media is
truly a great manipulator, isn't it?

But Charles, the reports you posted, the retaliations Walter referred to -
how do these reports - to you - compare to the destruction in the US on
9-11-01?  I feel a sort of ugly americanism thread running through all this.
But perhaps I'm misinterpreting your contributions.

Still with hope.
Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 13:05:54 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Aldon Hynes <ahynes1@YAHOO.COM>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from Colorado
In-Reply-To:  <2d.1108f0f0.28d50168@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Sheryl wrote:
"The media is truly a great manipulator, isn't it?"
I read that at the same time as someone pointed me to
an article from Jerusalem
(http://www.jerusalem-times.net/news/n1.htm)

"A team sent by the Israel Defense Ministry to film
Palestinian children rejoicing in East Jerusalem,
staged the event that was later circulated in the US
and around the world.
A member of the team approached the Juhaina Sweets
Shop and gave the owner 200 shekels and asked him to
distribute the sweets to the children, according to
the owner of the shop.
Veteran Israeli political analyst Meron Benvenisti, a
former deputy mayor of Jerusalem, noted in Ha'aretz
(Thursday, Sept.13):
"A team from the Spokesman's Office of the Israel
Defense Forces was sent to film the scenes of joy and
candy being handed out in East Jerusalem 'for public
relations purposes,' Benvenisti wrote."

I am not sure I believe that report any more or less
than the reports about the celebrations, but it does
go to Sheryl's point quite nicely.  We need to think
very carefully about taking the news, even the video
clips on TV as reflecting what is really going on.

She goes on to write, "how do these reports - to you -
compare to the destruction in the US on 9-11-01?"

I can't asnwer for others, but to me, they compare
very closely.  Last night my neighbor stopped by and
told me the best man from his wedding and several
other friends were killed by the act of hatred carried
out against the citizens of the United States.  The
acts of hatred against people of Arabic descent, while
currently on a smaller scale, is the same act of
hatred.

I am struggling with my anger, sadness and grief.  I
pray for justice.  I spend time in reflection trying
to find constructive ways of dealing with these
feelings instead of lashing out the same way the
terrorists lashed out.  So far, the only constructive
thing I have found to do is to try and the people I am
in touch with to explore their own anger, sadness and
grief and hopefully work together to find ways of
using it constructively to make a better world.

I read one person, who I think captured this quite
well, in the call for justice and not for revenge.

I am sorry if my thoughts or feelings are poorly
constructed.  It is a terrible time for me right now.

Aldon

__________________________________________________
Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help?
Donate cash, emergency relief information
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 18:17:49 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "J.Wyatt Ehrenfels" <Ehrenfels@FIREFLYSUN.COM>
Subject:      Proposed Dream Research
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Some of you have reported dreams (or varying types of references in dreams)
to the tragedy prior to its occurrence.  An associate of mine, who began an
original yet empirical study of precognition in dreams in 1996, has decided
in light of recent events to proceed with this research.  The research will
take place in two concurrent modules:

(1) My associate noticed that the references are of varying types and
address various aspects of the tragedy.  He wishes to collect dreams people
believe are related to the tragedy in an attempt to isolate factors which
account for (or are associated with) the different types of precognitive
references.

(2) My associate also wishes to collect dreams (of no relationship to the
tragedy) using an original methodology he designed in 1996 (involving pre-
and post-dream questionnaires) to explore preliminary findings that dreams
are more related to the waking days that immediately follow the dream than
to the day or days immediately preceding the dream.

I wholly endorse his research and have offered up my services to him as
collector of data.  If you wish to participate in either module 1 or 2 of
this research, please let me know.  He is known for debriefing his research
participants fully and his results will also be published in my new
non-fiction book on dreams, which I will write immediately upon release of
my current novel. Please forward this e-mail along to anyone you feel might
wish to participate in this research.

His masters research in 1996 was on the verge of some fascinating findings
before the research was re-directed by a faculty advisor who feared the
results, despite meeting empirical requirements, would be perceived as
"witch-craft" (i.e., contrary to conventional notions or expectations) by
other members of his thesis committee.

Sincerely,


J. Wyatt Ehrenfels
http://www.fireflysun.com
ehrenfels@fireflysun.com

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Sep 2001 18:57:08 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from Colorado
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Sheryl:

> But Charles, the reports you posted, the retaliations Walter referred to -
> how do these reports - to you - compare to the destruction in the US on
> 9-11-01?  I feel a sort of ugly americanism thread running through all
this.
> But perhaps I'm misinterpreting your contributions.

They don't compare, and I don't think anyone thinks they do.  That's the
short version.

The longer version, for me, is that my most recent professional role was as
a monitor of religious extremism in another highly volatile situation -- the
rollover to January 1 2000.  Then as now, religious terrorism was in the
air, and part of my work as principal researcher with the Center for
Millennial Studies involved monitoring terrorist groups in the US and
abroad, hate groups, Christian Identity, etc.  At least two "home grown"
terrorist attacks were in fact defused by the FBI, one in California, one in
Florida if I recall, in the immediate runoff to Y2K.  And Bin Laden was a
concern then, too, with some of his people coming in via the Canadian
border, one group at least having LA as a target, and so on.

In some ways I feel as though that situation was a dry run for the kind of
monitoring I'm doing now, and I'm concerned with all manifestations of
religious hatred, and with understanding the motivations at work in groups
as diverse as the al-Quaeda and the Quakers -- because my task is to model
the various dynamics at work in an incredibly subtle situation.

If, along the way, I can help us avoid intolerance in responding to an
intolerable situation, that will be a side product I'll appreciate -- not
least because I love these United States in which I have lived about half
the years of my life, where my wife and sons were born, and love it amongs
other reasons for the freedom from intolerance which it struggles time and
again to offer.

I hope this explanation helps, but know it's shorthand for something that
might take a book to explain -- which is why I shall be writing for some
months to come!

Regards to yourself, Walter, Stephen and all...


--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Rheingold Associates
http://www.rheingold.com/associates

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 15:27:03 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ Prayer from Colorado
In-Reply-To:  <82.1012c3b3.28d4a4dc@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Sheryl

> I
> still write in peace and love

I do too.

You have(or had) misgivings...  I felt clumsy and slightly fearful as i
wrote them.  It *is* a difficult time to communicate fully and openly.
Charles called this "an incredibly subtle situation" - which is how i see
it.  Ironic that something so blatantly violent can lead on the other hand
to

Hurt anger, the need for justice and the need for *safety* can easily be
seen as a cry for war. Fear and opposition to war can be seen as a
callousness about the tragic death of innocent people.

Charles and Stephen have said better and added to what was going through my
mind with my post.

I believe that dialogue, respect, humanity and prayer are called for...

~~~

Today, I feel more fearful and opposed to the proposed war - this is not an
anti American feeling - in fact my feelings and thorough reasoning against
a war reprisal are articulated all over the Internet, by Americans as much
as anyone. Unfortunately it is not so clear in the mainstream media.

~~~

That is my view right now... I know that it will be different to other
people's... I hope we can continue dialogue while we have different views
and feelings - that is my hope for the world too!


Walter

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 15:45:49 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Islam/Muslim/Spirituality
In-Reply-To:  <p04330100b7c9299c1552@[207.54.160.176]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Stephen

I think you understood my intentions:

> If I were a Muslim, I would have read Walter's note as intending to express
> his concern for me and any Muslim who was subjected to being lumped with
> the demonic extremists ('Islamicism' is the modern term for the extremist's
> beliefs,) and pursuant to the expected outcome of such a gross projection,
> as Charles reports, threatened and persecuted. That's how I read it.

I also understand how Sheryl might see something clumsy in my post... In my
wish that you are here - there is an implied doubt that you might not be -
which is unwarranted ....  damn - I feel trapped by my own words.

~~~

> I hope I've described my own situation clearly enough. I take complete
> responsibility for creating the confusion in the first place; I'm sorry. On
> the other hand, I hope my point about the deep impulse of surrender as a
> focal point for being in service to the cause of peace is not totally lost
> here.

I am a bit lost... I am unclear about Islam and reading and learning as
much as i can.  I would like to hear more about your spiritual life.  I am
unclear about the distinction between being in Islam and being Muslim - I
thought they were the same, clearly i am wrong.

I am not sure if this is the time or place for more of this discussion for
you - and will respect your response or silence.

Walter

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 01:48:14 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Islam/Muslim/Spirituality
In-Reply-To:  <vrraqtsk4lhuc7bkunkdq5pjq216traghv@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Walter, all,

>I am a bit lost... I am unclear about Islam and reading and learning as
>much as i can.  I would like to hear more about your spiritual life.  I am
>unclear about the distinction between being in Islam and being Muslim - I
>thought they were the same, clearly i am wrong.

It's a good time for such a discussion, with the caveat that it can't help
us understand much beyond my idiosyncratic submission.

But, you wrote, "I feel trapped by my own words" and that's germane when
extended to *understanding*, because, as far as I can tell, one of the
'hidden' predicaments is precisely the trap words set for us. And the
paradox is: what else can save us but words?

***

About my spiritual life, the question probably has to be 'Why are you not a
Muslim?' The answer is simple: I reject the divisions between both the
exoteric 'sociological' aspects and the esoteric immanent aspects that
differentiate the religions. That's why I said in my previous post that it
is ridiculous to think only Muslims may submit themselves to God; may be
"in Islam".

In my specific case I suppose the transmission got screwed up, but the
decision made years ago was based on a simple proposition: to trust my own
experience. I also decided to pray as much as I possibly could pray. I have
proven to my self over the years that praying is easy; trusting one's own
experience is very difficult, at least for me. Those two elements define my
own 'Islam' or submission.

My approach has zero status with respect to any Traditions. On the other
hand, my teachers never did or do not bring my deviation up. And, neither
do I.

***

A Muslim practices the religion of Islam. Islam has a fascinating history,
and one billion plus adherents all over the globe. I can't help anybody
understand the religion of Islam. However, I would suggest that beyond the
very few basics most persons who call themselves Muslims share, the
religion of Islam is far from monolithic with the differences between both
formally divided sects and divisions brought forth by divergences in
practice and, especially, the ways in which Islam absorbed some conceptions
and routines from the religions of peoples converted to Islam, having
obtained a variety of approaches.

One can't get from <No God But God> to anywhere *but* 'submission'. (As my
own teacher puts it, "Only 5% in-training,".) That's the fact of the inner
tradition in all the religions of the revealed Book(s). imo

***

But the biggest prejudice I see acted out today is the ignorant traducing
of the problematic element as having something to do with Islam, when it is
obvious to me that what it really has to do with is human nature,
everybody's human nature. We refuse to see the obvious. Nobody should be
surprised that this eventually pushes us right to the brink of disaster.
Hey, Walter, ask your self: what is most essential to you? What makes you
terrified? What makes you despair? What did you refuse, today?


regards,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 01:54:31 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Islam/Muslim/Spirituality
In-Reply-To:  <p04330102b7cb310b4526@[207.54.160.128]>
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all,

A correction. "by divergences in practice and, especially, the ways in
which Islam absorbed some conceptions and routines from the religions of
peoples converted to Islam, having obtained a variety of approaches."

should read,

"by divergences in <belief about some concepts and history> and,
especially, the ways in which Islam absorbed some conceptions and routines
from the religions of peoples converted to Islam, having obtained a variety
of approaches."

But, as I've stated, my authority on this matter is zilch.

***

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 07:43:04 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      question
Mime-Version: 1.0
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all,

Tomorrow is a new day, a new week. Sunday -today- is the last day of last
week in the odd way that the biggest newspaper of the week, the leisure of
the Sunday morning, the ways in which my own time is still hooked up to the
rhythms of a 'careering' world I have never joined. Rhythm.

***

If I feel around our group here I am aware of the vicissitudes shared here.
Terribleness in the neutral, human sense.

Today -here in f2f- we had moved to the gallows humor stage. Went to a nice
party with Judith. But, really, I was in a daze most of the day and thought
at one point I had lost my keys. Became very unsettled because I almost
never lose anything like keys.
***

If I told you what the world is going to be like in one year, would you
want to know? That's a heavy question whether I know the future or not. It
also transcends psychology if you really think about it, gets beyond what
'eggs', what 'basket'.

I had a dream -this is the first time I've shared it- this week: the world
was engulfed by the end game of all the arsenals being launched, perspected
by terrible fireballs rolling through urban canyons and over countrysides.
Then, this huge faint yellowish glowing ball blots out this horrific scene
and as my personal perspective withdraws it turns out to be hovering
between the earth and the moon.

The next thing I know I am witnessing great good and powerful and evil
personages being assembled one by one in a mountaintop field. They are,
evidently, being transported via some blueish beam of light. Once assembled
they wander around speechless. Everybody is there, tens of people, Bin
Laden, the Dali Lama, Bush etc. This impossibly dark green human with
bright green eyes in a navy suit arrives.

The dark green man 'rolls' the movie in the sky and we all see it is
rolling backwards through time (explosions in reverse, skyscrapers
reassembling, etc.) right up until the time we see a panicking submarine
crew's launch control team's hands turn the launch keys back to the ready
position.

Still speechless, the entire group is transported and takes a grand tour of
every possible variety of human wealth and wretchedness. (Others in the
group: Saddam, Putin, Gore, Blair, Havel, etc.) The thing is: every scene
is frozen, in suspended animation, so the group walks about the scenery of
real life among vast stages of human life totally stopped, eerily colorful
but completely silent, completely still.

The entire group is returned to the mountaintop field and assembles
themselves in a semi-circle with the dark green man with the glowing eyes
their focus point. The pinkish sphere hangs in the distant sky. The
'projected' scene returns to the submariners, their hands now drawn back
from the launch keys and the scene frozen.

The dream ends when the man says to all of them:

"Your universe is a tiny bubble. There are untold such bubbles, bubbles
upon bubbles. But, in my people's travels we have, so far, found human life
or its remnants, remains, only on one earth in each universe. We've
explored untold numbers of earths on untold numbers of universes, almost
all show that humans were once there but had extinguished themselves.
You're the first earth we've found since we learned how to reverse time one
hour. Which is good because we arrive here an hour into what you see.

There's a right answer. You may ask me only one question."

***

Dream woke me at 4:44. I'm along for the ride in this one; maybe a
necessary witness. It's a big dream; first significant transpersonal dream
I've ever had. Don't know what to think really. If its about my own psyche,
I get know strong sense because my role in the dream is as an observer and
not a central figure with some imperative aching to be integrated.

Here it is. What do you get from it? How far down does it go? How do you
trust a dream like this?

***

regards,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 06:55:34 -0600
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         =?iso-8859-1?Q?=22Robert_G=2E_Longpr=E9=22?=
              <aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA>
Subject:      Re: question
In-Reply-To:  <p04330101b7cb26ece304@[207.54.160.128]>
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Stephen, all,

Words for me have been absent.  Even on my JUNG-L list I have been
silent.  I can hardly accept the facts shown to me every time I turn on the
TV and wonder how it must feel to those who have been directly touched by
the tragedy.  I know ALL of us have been touched regardless of the side of
the fence we find ourselves, regardless of allegiance, regardless even of
straddling fences.  And I think that this is critical to understand ...
this is about all of us.

Tarot card, the TOWER.  Prophecies of Nostradamus.  Look where you
will.  This is not a simple, horrible, isolated act.

>If I told you what the world is going to be like in one year, would you
>want to know? That's a heavy question whether I know the future or not. It
>also transcends psychology if you really think about it, gets beyond what
>'eggs', what 'basket'.

In a way, I think we "know" already, Stephen.  And, that knowing is what is
causing us so much shock regardless of our distance from the towers of New
York.  That said, I will say that I want to know more, and more, and
more.  This is about the world, and it is about the individual in the
world, about all of the trees in the forest.

>Dream woke me at 4:44. I'm along for the ride in this one; maybe a
>necessary witness. It's a big dream; first significant transpersonal dream
>I've ever had. Don't know what to think really. If its about my own
>psyche, I get know strong sense because my role in the dream is as an
>observer and not a central figure with some imperative aching to be integrated.
>
>Here it is. What do you get from it? How far down does it go? How do you
>trust a dream like this?

How do you not trust your dreams, even your nightmares.  The unconscious,
both personal and collective, do find a voice in dreams.  At times, the
content of dreams are so weird, so strange that we dismiss them out of hand
as just dreams though there is much in them for us.  And at other times,
there is stuff so horrible that we dismiss the dreams as due to a digestive
disorder.  What do I get from your dream?  A glimmer of hope.

love, Robert

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 12:55:59 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <PumpknSoul@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Attack on US/ WHO IS HERE?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
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ALL...

May I ask a quick favor of ALL of you to respond to this post or any other
post to Psbyer-L?

In my swirling thoughts, and yes including precognitions and being strongly
triggered by Stephen's dream, the thought occurred to me that one or some of
us may have been lost in the attack.  I feel somewhat ashamed for not having
thought of this sooner.

So to soothe my very troubled soul, could each of you let the rest of us know
you are ok?

Thank you, love to all -
Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 16:56:50 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: question
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Thank you for telling us your dream, Stephen.


--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Rheingold Associates
http://www.rheingold.com/associates

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 21:40:26 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ WHO IS HERE?
In-Reply-To:  <37.1af337c6.28d7851f@aol.com>
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Here, Sheryl...sitting in my quietness

Blessings,
Judith

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Sep 2001 22:13:32 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Janell F. Adair" <jfadair9@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Attack on US/Who is here
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Sheryl:


      Here, alive and well,  in Pennsylvania midway between NYC and =
Washington D.C.,  except for the emotional trauma of what's happened =
last Tuesday.


            Janell

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 18 Sep 2001 18:03:22 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ WHO IS HERE?
In-Reply-To:  <37.1af337c6.28d7851f@aol.com>
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Sheryl,

Yes good thought.  In virtual places it is hard to know what happens in rl!
We have the following members.  It is interesting how as the list is
smaller how the names are all more familiar.

Walter

PumpknSoul@AOL.COM       Sheryl Garner
hoon@APK.NET             Stephen Calhoun
judithb@APK.NET          Judith Buerkel
hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET    Charles Cameron
jfadair9@EARTHLINK.NET   Janell Adair
ehrenfels@FIREFLYSUN.COM Wyatt Ehrenfels
dan@GROUPSENSE.CO.NZ     Dan Randow
flamingleaf@HOTMAIL.COM  Linda Oulton
bbc@MAIL.DANBBS.DK       Bent Bgedal Christoffersen
nsmith@NEGIA.NET         Nancy Smith
jfadair9@PHILLY.INFI.NET Janell Adair
walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ   Walter Logeman
simon@SIMBIOSIS.COM      Simon G. Trask
aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA    Robert Longpre
rcarls2@UMBC.EDU         Rob Carlson
sswan@USD.EDU            Susan Swan
ahynes1@YAHOO.COM        Aldon Hynes

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:54:49 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <PumpknSoul@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Attack on US/ WHO IS HERE?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
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Thank you all, I'm very relieved to hear you are alright, Judith and Janell.
I still wonder about some of the others you listed, Walter.

Janell, so in the middle geographically of it all, this must be impacting you
enormously and constantly?

When I posted my query, one person I was thinking of was Rob.  I've since
visited his weblog and he has updated re: the attack, so I presume he is ok.

There are other on-line friends I have not heard from - these concern me.  I
also realized this week end that one of my husband's aunts, a wonderfully
active intelligent vital lady in her 80's who has continued to work for the
government, lives near Washington, and in fact works a mile from the
Pentagon.  Fortunately, she had a dentist appointment the morning of the
attacks.  I cannot imagine though, the sort of emotional reaction that would
have taken place in the Garner family if something had happened to her.  They
are an enormous clan compared to those my own family.

Connections seem to be coming a little closer to me now all the time.  I've
been thinking about that fable about the nature of a scorpion (does anyone
know which fable I'm talking about?) and my own nature - I seem to have some
very difficult to overcome maternal, protective tendencies of all those I
love and care about, which includes all of you in Psbyerian space.

With love to all
Sheryl

--- For now I'm letting thoughts of war (how it would be fought or against
whom?)  be like little pieces of fish food, just floating as they do to the
bottom of the tank.   Far more intelligent minds than mine will deal with it,
but I have at least found a sense of love for my country/countrymen that has
been dried up since Viet Nam.

In the place of attack against trust, hope, and naivitee', I'm again seeing a
beauty in others that has seemed long missing.

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:35:53 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      connections
In-Reply-To:  <6b.1ad41a53.28d8ba39@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Sheryl, all,

> I seem to have some
>very difficult to overcome maternal, protective tendencies of all those I
>love and care about, which includes all of you in Psbyerian space.
>
>With love to all
>Sheryl

I appreciate those tendencies. Thank you for being so forthright. *caring*
is gift one gives, and I, for one, like to get it and give it.

***

Judith yesterday mentioned to me the '6 degrees' concept that makes
concrete how one is eventually connected to another along -at a minimum-
conceptual parameters. The dark events of 9/11 connect us with the victims
and the suffering and healing along the most simple concept: "do you know
somebody who knows somebody who knows...".

It was within hours of the event that I learned about many persons for whom
my own degree of removal was but 2 degrees. For example, I know the mother
of the son who knew a person who is missing. (I belong to a NYC-based list
that offered many 2 and 3 degree connections.) In fact, it would surprise
me to find out that there is somebody I know who is farther than 6 degrees
from the direct wounding effects.

This reminder from Judith really struck me deeply.

***

regards, peace.

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 19 Sep 2001 10:41:26 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Nancy Smith <nsmith@NEGIA.NET>
Subject:      WorldWall3
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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A memorial to lost friends in 62 countries, Nancy

 http://www.wordmachine1.com/WorldWall3.html

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 22 Sep 2001 01:38:55 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Chester Street
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Hi all,

Well we have done it - it our home for 20 yrs is up for auction.  These
life changes  - especially the anguish of getting it right - absorb most of
my energy

http://www.open2view.com/Property/15996

Makes me sad to see it there, but have also come to terms with it more or
less.  If we can't live there - we need to let it go.

Didn't I get it tidy!

Spent three days so far clearing out - many more to go!

~~~

In the midst of it all Kate & i went to a vigil here in Square - Mayor -
speakers from major faiths - Anclican Cathederal dean, Muslims, Jews, Maori
- all on the theme justice not revenge. Good to be there.


Walter

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 21 Sep 2001 07:31:39 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Aldon Hynes <ahynes1@YAHOO.COM>
Subject:      Re: Chester Street
In-Reply-To:  <ivdmqtghov5iqmalj5q3i3oediso4lu177@4ax.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Walter,

   I can understand your sadness about leaving Chester
Street.  The house is beautiful.  If I could find a
job in ChristChurch, I would move to New Zealand and
buy your house in a moment.

Aldon

__________________________________________________
Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help?
Donate cash, emergency relief information
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/

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Date:         Sun, 23 Sep 2001 19:32:48 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Auden poem
In-Reply-To:  <20010921143139.78852.qmail@web13807.mail.yahoo.com>
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SEPTEMBER 1, 1939
       W.H. Auden




                I sit in one of the dives
                On Fifty-second Street
                Uncertain and afraid
                As the clever hopes expire
                Of a low dishonest decade:
                Waves of anger and fear
                Circulate over the bright
                And darkened lands of the earth,
                Obsessing our private lives;
                The unmentionable odour of death
                Offends the September night.

                Accurate scholarship can
                Unearth the whole offence
                From Luther until now
                That has driven a culture mad,
                Find what occurred at Linz,
                What huge imago made
                A psychopathic god:
                I and the public know
                What all schoolchildren learn,
                Those to whom evil is done
                Do evil in return.

                Exiled Thucydides knew
                All that a speech can say
                About Democracy,
                And what dictators do,
                The elderly rubbish they talk
                To an apathetic grave;
                Analysed all in his book,
                The enlightenment driven away,
                The habit-forming pain,
                Mismanagement and grief:
                We must suffer them all again.

                Into this neutral air
                Where blind skyscrapers use
                Their full height to proclaim
                The strength of Collective Man,
                Each language pours its vain
                Competitive excuse:
                But who can live for long
                In an euphoric dream;
                Out of the mirror they stare,
                Imperialism's face
                And the international wrong.

                Faces along the bar
                Cling to their average day:
                The lights must never go out,
                The music must always play,
                All the conventions conspire
                To make this fort assume
                The furniture of home;
                Lest we should see where we are,
                Lost in a haunted wood,
                Children afraid of the night
                Who have never been happy or good.

                The windiest militant trash
                Important Persons shout
                Is not so crude as our wish:
                What mad Nijinsky wrote
                About Diaghilev
                Is true of the normal heart;
                For the error bred in the bone
                Of each woman and each man
                Craves what it cannot have,
                Not universal love
                But to be loved alone.

                From the conservative dark
                Into the ethical life
                The dense commuters come,
                Repeating their morning vow;
                'I will be true to the wife,
                I'll concentrate more on my work,'
                And helpless governors wake
                To resume their compulsory game:
                Who can release them now,
                Who can reach the dead,
                Who can speak for the dumb?

                All I have is a voice
                To undo the folded lie,
                The romantic lie in the brain
                Of the sensual man-in-the-street
                And the lie of Authority
                Whose buildings grope the sky:
                There is no such thing as the State
                And no one exists alone;
                Hunger allows no choice
                To the citizen or the police;
                We must love one another or die.


                Defenseless under the night
                Our world in stupor lies;
                Yet, dotted everywhere,
                Ironic points of light
                Flash out wherever the Just
                Exchange their messages:
                May I, composed like them
                Of Eros and of dust,
                Beleaguered by the same
                Negation and despair,
                Show an affirming flame.

***

Stephen

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