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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 2 Jul 2000 23:51:14 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] REFLECTION
In-Reply-To:  <pitnlssho8tbcbghboaq86fqr1e3vneq7r@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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all,

Greetings. The Circle of Connections Game has arrived at the penultimate
moment. The game board is complete and we've arrived at the cusp of STEP
FOUR: REFLECTION.

Before sending the notification of the COC Game Board's URL, I'd like to
share a few notes and tips about Reflection as I have noted it done in
other exercises I've facilitated.

***

(1) There is no wrong or right reflection.

(2) Participants and observers, through reflection become
participant/observers!

(3) Tip: Keep a written record of everything that comes up as your explore
and discover the COC Game Board.

(4) Share what you feel you'd like to share.

(5) Tip: (A few ideas about questions you can ask during reflection)

What leaps out?

What is obvious?

What is contradictory?

What is confusing?

What is consonant/sympathetic/synchronous?

What resonates?

What causes tension?

What is ordinary/boring/facile?

What questions come up?

What more would be interesting to know?

What is numinous/sacred/surprising/extraordinary?

What has a bearing on my own personal concerns?

(etc.!)

***

The original intention provided for this game was: *This game is intended
to *resolve* a soulful spontaneous snapshot of Psyber-L.*

The point of reflection is to enhance the resolution and depth of field!
So, in reflection we increase the resolution of details, expand the
creative field suggested by not only the game board itself but by our
intention to explore and discover what comes up...

Through our collaborative reflection we develop the snapshot; in fact,
we'll -no doubt- develop quite a few different pictures of Psyber-L.

By all means have fun with it.

Looking forward to the developments,

Stephen

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 3 Jul 2000 00:03:50 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] The Game Board: unveiled!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

The CIRCLE OF CONNECTIONS Game Board is complete and unveiled.

It is revealed -privately- for Psyber-L's eyes' only, here:

http://www.psybernet.co.nz/circle/

Before the page loads you will have to in-put the following:

username = psyber
password = circle

Congratulations to all participants!

(STEP 4) REFLECTION: Open to all game participants and subscribers to
Psyber-L.

The game board will be revealed to both participants and observers of the
game. For this reflection, the group intention is along the lines of: "What
comes up for you? What do you see? What connections do you sense? What
resonates for you?" (etc.).

***

You may access the COC Game Board at anytime. The page is 175k in size, and
a smaller version designed for 15" (640 x 480) browsers is available
through a link. Also, each position has a page devoted to it for a closer
look at the submitted image.

The nine positions start with #1 at 12 O'clock and run clockwise.

*Please use in your subject line: [COC GAME} for all submitted
reflections*. They can be submitted at any time.

***

Would you agree to share your reflections in running log? In other words,
may I add each reflection as it comes in, to a running notation to be
archived in the same secure folder as the game?

Think about this and let me know with your submitted reflections whether
you wish for them to be added or not added.



Thanks to all!

Stephen

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 3 Jul 2000 04:04:22 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Miles THompson <utunga@PARADISE.NET.NZ>
Subject:      [COC GAME]
Comments: To: "[COC"@paradise.net.nz, GAME}@paradise.net.nz
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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though i have a meeting in.. (now)
i just could not resist the temptation to look at the board...

---
first reaciton, a quick rush to the head
and my exclaiming out loud..


aaaahhh that's *fantastic* !!

must fly

but well done all...

more thoughts to come..
--
uhh.. Stephen, thanks a million despite my
lame first attempt..

you may publish the above to the running log if you wish..

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 4 Jul 2000 14:07:00 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME]
In-Reply-To:  <395F6806.6005ADFF@paradise.net.nz>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

Reflection...

Initially it took time to find a way into the circle...the question
became where is the point from which I view possible
connections...after time I found I could only start from the quote
(my contribution) which resonated
"Real faith is that this entity...in the midst of intense feeling
stays. All our work is about that, not how to get away but how to
stay." (richard Moss Words that Shine Both Ways)

What struck me was that it takes staying in order to create harmony,
to find ways to relate to other participants...it takes "real faith"
for souls to express their individual uniqueness, that it takes the
work of staying in order to mature, to have opportunity for
rejuvenation, to find what possibilities remain for discovery, for
learning together...and the circle is asking this of us, to find the
way into the circle with our physicalness fenced out

Judith

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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jul 2000 09:13:12 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION
In-Reply-To:  <v04220801b585c76c6024@[207.54.160.130]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Stephen, Walter, all:

>What leaps out?

It is, I suppose, a rather hipbonegame-ish thing to say, but, the
juxtaposition of guitar and sitar on our board brings to my mind the
similarity of those two words, and the somehow related fact that George
Harrison's song "While my guitar gently weeps" seems in some private ritual
process of my mind to demand its Indian parallel, "While my sitar gently
weeps".

Perhaps it's just the George Harrison was into sitar kind of thing.

In any case, I'm so convinced that the two phrases belong together that
until today I had no doubt but that Harrison's words derived from the
British poet Harold Morland's little known versions of Kalidasa, published
under the title %bold(My Seeking Spirit).

So I (a) dug out my copy of Morland's Kalidasa, and found in # vii, Morland
writing "Guitar that gently weeps" -- this in 1966, mark you -- and (b)
consulted the web in search of sitars weeping, and found this --
http://www.the-times.co.uk/news/pages/tim/99/09/21/timartwrl02001.html --
obituary in The Times for a man who seems to have been a master of the
sitar and friend of Geo H, as well as Ravi's nephew and Udhay's son.  About
whom I had previously known nothing.  Whose work I must hear.

Morland, translating the Indian Kalidasa, uses the word "guitar": one can
only guess what the original Sanskrit was.  But for Shankar, Ananda -- the
name means "bliss" -- in the pages of London's newspaper of record,
rightfully, a sitar gently weeps...

Regards,

--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Senior Analyst, The Arlington Institute <chasc@arlingtoninstitute.org>
HipBone Games http://home.earthlink.net/~hipbone

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jul 2000 13:10:57 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <CMCPsych@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Game reflections:

I felt an initial experience of joy upon viewing the board, at the bringing
together of this circle, a disparate collection of images and thoughts that
somehow contained a universal commonality of desire to belong to something
that exists somewhere, or nowhere, but certainly exists in several faraway
places in other minds than just mine.

A desire for connection, questions within the connection, of how to proceed,
how do I proceed?  Will what I have to say fit anywhere in this place that
certainly does exist?

who truly will play?

Buildings and music resonate for me, but how in the world can a building
resonate, does it symbolize some creation of man, is that also what we
represent here?

the empty benches split by a pole have some odd impact on me, what they
symbolize, how they connect with *Walterworld.*

Lots of other thoughts and experiences, and also wondering what will emerge
from other players.

Sheryl

PS Stephen you can use this in the log, and thank you for this wonderful
expression of your creativity.  Along with providing us with this opportunity.

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 5 Jul 2000 19:34:46 +0200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bent_B=F8gedal_Christoffersen?=
              <bbc@MAIL.DANBBS.DK>
Organization: Metusalem Art & music
Subject:      Sv:      [P] [COC GAME] REFLECTION
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

All and Stephen
 I cant reconize my own statement in this game.
 the interpretation of the sentance I have send
is not was I was thinking of.
So now I really feel like I wrote

Why do I feel like a lamp between two empty benches and anxiety about =
this game.?

> (a) written: a one sentence intention, or wish, or question, that best
> expresses -in the moment- the participant's idea about what is next =
for,
> or, is to be learned about Psyber-L.



bent

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=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jul 2000 13:34:25 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION
In-Reply-To:  <v04220801b585c76c6024@[207.54.160.130]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Stephen, all!

I really appreciate this COC!

> What leaps out?

The words Walterworld leapt out.  I dont like the notion of this
as a "walterworld!" ... less the idea that if there was a
Walterworld that it would be one of empty benches, so I was
struck by that for a while.  I dont mean to understate the role I
play here as list owner etc. but there is a sad truth that if I
don't do my job well then it can be too much a walterworld.  The
art of hosting and so on is to do it almost invisibly.

So Bent, with the new words you have sent the tension has gone,
and I feel I can look at the benches in a new light (new light -
resonates for me!)

> What is obvious?

That we have done it!  A quick game, with real depth and impact.

> What resonates?

My move was the one about rejuvenation.  Have a look at the image
in full, worth the download time IMO:

http://www.psybernet.co.nz/mccahon.htm

It is the middle image of a 1959 Colin McCahon Triptych called
Elias.  He is the #1 New Zealand painter for fame!

I searched for images in the book of photos "Family of man"
looked at the birth photos there and the groups... the baby
seemed to young, yet i wanted the notion of something young and
fragile... the word "rejuvenation" cam up in the group, Sheryl I
think, that still fitted, but i think of us as growing into
maturity.

I found the image and this second of the triptych was the first i
saw, and there was no doubt.  It had a feel of the tree I have
used a lot with Psybernet, and the dark colour i feel fits well
here.  the old and the new.  Only later did i see the full
Christian rebirth images of the whole triptych.

The resonation for me is with the image from NO 2

|  for Psyber-L to be experienced as a space in which souls
|  expressing individual uniqueness connect
|  in these moments of time, leaving a collective resonation
|  of the sacredness of our journey together

The building has the sort of "maturity" I was thinking of.

> What is numinous/sacred/surprising/extraordinary?

Not surprising but certainly inspiring:  the musical themes, the
resonance of the idea of resonance.

> What more would be interesting to know?

How the opposite to resonance... alienation which is also present
in the circle... absence too perhaps... how we can face this
shadowy side.

It would also be of interest to me -- ONCE this reflection is
complete, to reflect on the more technical aspects of
facilitation of this event -- to draw out the principles of this
excellent work.


All for now -- back to my full on time in London!


Walter
______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

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=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 6 Jul 2000 22:18:02 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Greg Marshkan <Marshkan@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] : timeframe
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Stephen,

Sorry to have not been able to participate in the game. While my famiy was away on vacation during the past few weeks, my wife's father died. We are now back from the funeral,but still have not returned home yet. Will be eager to see the results nonetheless.

Greg

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 7 Jul 2000 13:41:56 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Update Notes
In-Reply-To:  <v04210106b587fde3167a@[207.54.160.103]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

Greetings. I've posted to Walter an update to the board. This includes
Bent's more resonant intention and adds in a page of logged reflections.
I've made placeholders for the reflections of Judith, Bent, Charles and
Walter because you didn't state your permission for their use as part of
the COC Game's published results.

If you folks want to give permission, feel free, and certainly you may do
it back-channel to: hoon@apk.net.

Walter will let us all know when the COC game is updated. I'll follow with
some notes of my own.

as always, I'm greatly appreciative,

Stephen

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 7 Jul 2000 13:45:38 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS - notes
In-Reply-To:  <0qm7msof2dtdq8lg5clhmk2tfsd16nvi0f@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

A few notes about the stage of reflection we're in right now.

One, You may contribute as many reflections as you wish. Probably most of
you know this already, but I wanted to make it explicit, again.

Two, anybody subscribed to Psyber-L may view the game board and contribute
to the reflections.

(I, for one, would like to see what our collaborative 'snap shot' brings up
for others.)

***

One question for everybody: what does the game look like if specifically
taken as a picture of the group?

For me, it is a portrait of great richness. I'll say more very soon.

***

regards, Stephen

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 7 Jul 2000 14:00:28 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] REFLECTION
In-Reply-To:  <001601bfe6a7$514a1640$e0dc61d4@oemcomputer>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Bent, all,

Bent, I've updated the board to note your more resonant intention. The
board shifts a little and that's great. The game's structure is not
inflexible.

We'll see about this *anxiety*. I'm reminded of how intrepid we're
sometimes asked to be here!

***

regards, Stephen

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 7 Jul 2000 13:57:39 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Real faith
In-Reply-To:  <v04210106b587fde3167a@[207.54.160.103]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Judith, all,

I've taken the liberty to identify your reflection for purposes of the
subject line on my response. "Real faith" seems apt, at least to me.

***

To use the game board to get into the game board; "not how to get away but
how to
stay.". We're all adventuring here together if we wish to. It does take
real faith and personal faith too. It's about believing in the process even
when it seems hard or obscure or unsettled/unsettling.

Something wants to come up. We stay and see, look harder, or maybe when we
least expect it, another layer is revealed.

Take the images:

empty benches wishing to be peopled,
archaic homes,
strings waiting to be played,
looking through a fence at development,
a colorful mandala of connections,
the coyote (trickster) howls,
exquisite balancing of the large upon the small,
instrument demanding virtuosity and with sympathetic strings,
free-falling toward something, with camera in-hand

All of this richness may be connected in ways only our staying-with-faith
may reveal.

Pretty darn cool, if you ask me!

***

best2all,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 7 Jul 2000 14:04:21 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] : timeframe
In-Reply-To:  <PSYBER-L%2000070622180209@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Greg,

My heart goes out to you.

***

If you want to, you may send me your move. The game remains a
work-in-progress.

***

best wishes,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 8 Jul 2000 00:04:14 +0200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bent_B=F8gedal_Christoffersen?=
              <bbc@MAIL.DANBBS.DK>
Organization: Metusalem Art & music
Subject:      Sv:      [P] [COC GAME] Update Notes
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear All

I see a lot of music in the coc game ,but............. as I told you I =
was going to
Roskilde festival for the 10 time and while pearl Jam was playing a =
stormful raining
night ,,,,, oh I can nearly not bare to tell , 9 young people died of =
suffocation
in a crowd in front of the scene,right in front of my wery eyes
 We were 90000 to the festival.  I was there together with my wife and =
children
and my freinds.
 The festival is 28 years old and its a part of the life here. And =
denmark has
only 5 000 000 people so in this little country it is big.
And it turned into one big crisis.
it happend friday night and the festival was soposed to stop sunday.
And a lot of reflection was needed
So as You can think I am not very fit to do much theese days ,we have a =
lot of
debat in the media and I am doing all i can to be together with all the =
Young people
that I know of who has been there.
And myself oh shit it could have been me....or my son ,my wife and =
daugther or my freinds.
Just a shit accident with the weather and the mud oh dam it ......

thank You stephen please do correct my sentence
Right now there is light in my lamp.
and thank You for a great work. Its beautiful.
And Walter thank You fot the response ,I `ll be back soon.
dead is a part of life but its a hard work.
=20

Love Bent


----- Oprindelig meddelelse -----=20
Fra: Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Til: <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sendt: 7. juli 2000 20:41
Emne: [P] [COC GAME] Update Notes


> all,
>=20
> Greetings. I've posted to Walter an update to the board. This includes
> Bent's more resonant intention and adds in a page of logged =
reflections.
> I've made placeholders for the reflections of Judith, Bent, Charles =
and
> Walter because you didn't state your permission for their use as part =
of
> the COC Game's published results.
>=20
> If you folks want to give permission, feel free, and certainly you may =
do
> it back-channel to: hoon@apk.net.
>=20
> Walter will let us all know when the COC game is updated. I'll follow =
with
> some notes of my own.
>=20
> as always, I'm greatly appreciative,
>=20
> Stephen
>=20
> ____________________________________________________________
> Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
> here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html
>=20
>=20
>=20

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 8 Jul 2000 20:37:30 -0600
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Robert G. Longpre" <aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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Stephen and all,

Reflections .... Like Bent I was struck by the vision of music.  Putting in
the 12 string guitar was an attempt to bring a circle to the square somewhat
like a mandala.  I like the balance, the symmetry of the guitar with the
other stringed instrument (it looks east-Indian, almost like a member of the
sitar family).   From our western world perspective it might seem to be
opposite to reality ... but my reality has me flying west to reach India.

My first overall impression was one of confusion besides being pleased with
the appearance.  I felt tensions of differences ... lean prose versus
pregnant prose ... simplicity versus complexity ... and it all seems right
in balance.

I have a fear of heights yet I felt comfortable with the parachutist with
camera plunging into a city.  I have felt/lived the lonely park benches as a
youth in the city.  And the kaleidescope ... in miniature it has the
appearance of a mandala ... up close it is busy, messy, vibrant ... more
will come

Robert

PS  Bent, I feel the heaviness of living with death, especially death at a
time of musical celebration ...  I am singing a song for you and your family
... and your friends.

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 08:56:25 -0600
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Robert G. Longpre" <aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA>
Subject:      The circle game ... non-participant response ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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Walter, Stephen, all ...

Now that we have begun to speak of our reflections about the game here on
the open group called PSYBER-L, I am wondering how this is working out for
those who didn't take part in the initial setting of the game board.  The
only voices speaking up at PSYBER-L are those who are the "participants" of
that game.  That leaves at least fourteen people of the twenty-three acting
as a shadowy audience ... maybe.

Walter, what have you noticed about this?  What do you feel about this?
This is radically different from the dream-events which had all the dialogue
limited to a sub-list which did leave the primary list open for open
discussion.  Do you think that this dedicated discussion on the open list
inhibits other dialogue?  Many questions with no answers ...

wondering,

Robert

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 09:08:13 -0600
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Robert G. Longpre" <aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA>
Subject:      responding to reflections
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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Dear Judith and all,

I don't know what to do next (and I am stubbornly not going back to read
game instructions) especially in regards to responding to the reflections of
others with the "resonances" that come out for myself.  I hope that this is
an acceptable part of the process.

Like yourself, I found that I made my starting point from my contribution, a
sort of grounding point from which I could look out.  From that point I
moved haphazardly through the other images letting them take me.  I ended up
with the coyote/trickster ... lone-wolf image.  I wondered if that lone-wolf
image hit others as hard as it hit me.  I am a lone wolf though I live in
family and community.  I thought of how we each came here "together" yet
still remain in out silent spaces in front of our computer screens ... alone
... regardless of our being "together" here in cyberspace.

> What struck me was that it takes staying in order to create harmony,
> to find ways to relate to other participants...it takes "real faith"
> for souls to express their individual uniqueness, that it takes the
> work of staying in order to mature, to have opportunity for
> rejuvenation, to find what possibilities remain for discovery, for
> learning together...and the circle is asking this of us, to find the
> way into the circle with our physicalness fenced out

I resonate strongly with what you are saying here, Judith ... the physical
presence separated from the inner world sense of self ... the attempt to
join with other inner selves through the circle ... a graphic portrayal of
the "split" that many live, that "I" live in the face-to-face day-to-day
world.

Sticking ... maturing ... faith ... hope ...

Looking outwards for a "harmony" (and I am taken again to music which is an
aural/oral action of creating/re-creating harmony) that is longed for by the
inner self.  Search for relatedness with "other" and ...

respectfully,

Robert

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 09:22:43 -0600
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Robert G. Longpre" <aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA>
Subject:      responding to reflections
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Charles and all,

Charles, I want to thank you for the link to Ananda Sitar.  I can remember
listening with rapture to Ravi Shankar in the sixties and know what you mean
when you say "my sitar gently weeps."  That music pulled from the core of
one's being.

> In any case, I'm so convinced that the two phrases belong together that
> until today I had no doubt but that Harrison's words derived from the
> British poet Harold Morland's little known versions of Kalidasa, published
> under the title %bold(My Seeking Spirit).

Charles, can you post this poem?  I don't have any of Morland's work nor
will I have access to his work for quite some time as I prepare to move from
one small town to another small town here in the empty spaces of
Saskatchewan, Canada.

with thanks,

Robert

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 13:13:58 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl
In-Reply-To:  <a1.79b5b26.2694c621@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Sheryl,

It occurs to me today that I looked at your contributed image and projected
coyote/trickster onto it.

What did you see this figure as when you found it?

(It's also a young dog howling. It seems a friendly sort of pup.)

***

wondering,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 13:18:04 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Update Notes
In-Reply-To:  <001e01bfe85f$4b78ac40$a1db61d4@oemcomputer>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Bent wrote,

>Just a shit accident with the weather and the mud oh dam it ......

That's a heavy tragedy. 'strings gently weep'. I'm relieved your family
made it through; albeit it clearly had to be a searing and grievous
experience

***

peace. Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 13:11:14 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC Game] Re: responding to reflections
In-Reply-To:  <00cf01bfea80$ac530a60$cc7ba58e@cyberie>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

Robert writes,

"I don't know what to do next (and I am stubbornly not going back to read
game instructions) especially in regards to responding to the reflections of
others with the "resonances" that come out for myself.  I hope that this is
an acceptable part of the process."

***

More than acceptable: it *is* the process.

All we have in this stage of the game is our reflective process and the
resonations which coalesce for each of us out of the shimmering potentials
in the creative field which we, first, set down in the collaborative game
board, and then, second, made into a collaborative "creative
work-in-progress".

Much more could be said about this, however, I'll simply suggest this be
thought of in terms of a question.

What does discovery about where something is really at, have to do with
change?

***

*resonation* works for me as term for valuation amidst a dynamic field.
This may seem like psyche-jargon to some. On the other hand, I've spent the
last five years, with Judith, groping for ways to talk about personal
processes, especially as they regard the dynamics of exploration,
discovery, change, action.

Perhaps 'resonation' doesn't resonate! There are alternatives, such as
asking what is valuable? Or, wondering about where the energy wants to go.
(Etc.)

The way one relates creatively to the process, is the process. Learning is
absolutely contingent upon this relation, no matter what the terms for it
are. Thus, simply, the question for every person here remains,

What comes up for you?

***

regards,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 11:17:17 -0600
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Robert G. Longpre" <aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA>
Subject:      responding to reflections
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Sheryl and all,

My dearest pumpkin-honoured friend, the pumpkin princess ... I am glad that
we are able to join in this game process together here.  Like yourself, I
find that there is a sense of joy that comes with the participation.
However, I must confess that my imagination had set me up for something
quite different than what I saw when I first saw the collected images in the
circle.  Not disappointment, more of a "jolt."

> A desire for connection, questions within the connection, of how to
proceed,
> how do I proceed?  Will what I have to say fit anywhere in this place that
> certainly does exist?

I sensed this as well ... and still feel this.  We are still in isolated
orbits around and empty centre in the image.  Perhaps that is what I sense
to be missing ... the core, the centre.  Looking at the circle I do see that
it can expand to fit more individuals and for them to fit in randomly or not
so randomly ...

What you have to say will fit, will always fit.  I think that I am too harsh
a critic on my
"self" in terms of what I say and my presence, always searching for "worth"
for "worthiness."  I sense this in your questions here as well.  But then
again, I am likely just hearing echoes of my own thoughts rather than what
you say, what you intend on saying.

respectfully,

Robert

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 11:23:51 -0600
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Robert G. Longpre" <aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA>
Subject:      responding to reflections
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Bent and all,

A powerful picture ... yet those words "Welcome to Walter's World" didn't
fit for me either.  Strange how those words actually grated.

> Why do I feel like a lamp between two empty benches and anxiety about this
game.?

This is much more in tune with the image, and being "in tune" is so
important (notice the musical reference).  That image of benches and lamp
fits well with the "whole" the "holistic" sense of beingness in this circle
for me.  I can see each of us feel that empty space between lamps, those
empty benches which interfere with connectivity.

And sometimes that lamp is turned off waiting for the next spark that will
encourage presence and the shining in the darkness of one's solitary light.

a pensive,

Robert

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 10 Jul 2000 22:35:26 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         "Janell F. Adair" <jfadair9@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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Stephen:

     I'm puzzled that you said Sheryl contributed the image of the howling
dog, or is it a coyote, or is it a wolf???   The reason I make this
observation and ask the question, is because I made the contribution of that
image along with my question: of What can I learn from this group???

    I haven't had time to make my observations or reflections (which I will
do soon), but I did want to clarify this fact for the group

        Peace.

     Janell

----- Original Message -----
From: Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
To: <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 2:13 PM
Subject: Re: [P] [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl


> Sheryl,
>
> It occurs to me today that I looked at your contributed image and
projected
> coyote/trickster onto it.
>
> What did you see this figure as when you found it?
>
> (It's also a young dog howling. It seems a friendly sort of pup.)
>
> ***
>
> wondering,
>
> Stephen
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
> here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html
>
>
>

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 15:10:49 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Miles THompson <utunga@PARADISE.NET.NZ>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Actually, I would really like to
be able to see who contributed what..

is there a reason why that is not available,
and if not.. how about we refine it a bit so
we can all see that ?


> Stephen:
>
>      I'm puzzled that you said Sheryl contributed the image of the howling
> dog, or is it a coyote, or is it a wolf???   The reason I make this
> observation and ask the question, is because I made the contribution of that
> image along with my question: of What can I learn from this group???
>
>     I haven't had time to make my observations or reflections (which I will
> do soon), but I did want to clarify this fact for the group
>
>         Peace.
>
>      Janell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
> To: <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
> Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 2:13 PM
> Subject: Re: [P] [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl
>
> > Sheryl,
> >
> > It occurs to me today that I looked at your contributed image and
> projected
> > coyote/trickster onto it.
> >
> > What did you see this figure as when you found it?
> >
> > (It's also a young dog howling. It seems a friendly sort of pup.)
> >
> > ***
> >
> > wondering,
> >
> > Stephen
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
> > here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html
> >
> >
> >
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
> here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 00:01:45 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl
In-Reply-To:  <00da01bfeae0$ad6ae160$158d1d3f@oemcomputer>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Janell,

Yes, it must have been a very puzzling miss-association of move with
player. Unintended too; nonetheless, I'm sorry. This raises my *Sheryl*
confusion, again. Please, take no personal offence due to my lack of
completed attention.

Players and others will note that the game board, when the update is
posted, will reflect important corrections to positions 'guitar' and
'sitar', all due to the same deficit of your humbled facilitator.

***

I would still like to know, if you wish to clarify for me, Janell, what the
image first represented to you.

excuse me,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 00:05:26 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl
In-Reply-To:  <396A9039.E8E7D6E9@paradise.net.nz>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Miles, all,

The initial anonymity of the board was part of the game structure. There
have been numerous references that identify the persons who made some of
the particular moves. I think, perhaps, over time, it will become more
clear as to who made what moves.

The info kind of bubbles out of, (hey, or bumbles out of!) the reflecting
goin' on.

***

regards, Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 10:37:10 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: responding to reflections
In-Reply-To:  <00f801bfea93$9e40c440$cc7ba58e@cyberie>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

All,

I'm taken with the juxtaposition of empty benches and music
making...it resonates to jazz for me...bringing my music making to
the group...some music makers are at home with the notes there before
them...playing in an orchestra, playing alone yet the musical road
defined, yet open to new interpretation...then there are the riffers
who bring their instrument and music making to a group and sit
in...at home in improvization, risk takers, the journey of discovery,
creating the connections as they explore the variations of the
melody...but all in the end passionate about music

Blessings,
Judith


>Bent and all,
>
>A powerful picture ... yet those words "Welcome to Walter's World" didn't
>fit for me either.  Strange how those words actually grated.
>
>> Why do I feel like a lamp between two empty benches and anxiety about this
>game.?
>
>This is much more in tune with the image, and being "in tune" is so
>important (notice the musical reference).  That image of benches and lamp
>fits well with the "whole" the "holistic" sense of beingness in this circle
>for me.  I can see each of us feel that empty space between lamps, those
>empty benches which interfere with connectivity.
>
>And sometimes that lamp is turned off waiting for the next spark that will
>encourage presence and the shining in the darkness of one's solitary light.
>
>a pensive,
>
>Robert
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
>here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 17:53:15 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <CMCPsych@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTION; ? for Sheryl
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Stephen, Janell, all...

I think by now that the coyote/trickster (I saw it as coyote, too, Janell)
image has been attributed to Janell.  But I find it a little interesting now,
Stephen, that you did confuse it as mine, so I wonder, do I bring up some
image as trickster for you?  Is there some aspect about me that brings this
up for you?

When I gave my initial reflections, I didn't identify my picture, but rather
tried expressing myself without constant, continual, self editing of my
thoughts translated into words, about the Circle, following along with the
questions suggested by Stephen.

It is very difficult for me to simply write without constant editing and
rechecking, and I've admired those of you who are able to write simply
straight from the heart.  It seems when I do that, and post, I go through a
period of anxiety, have I said too much, not enough?

My image is the *ruins* of Mesa Verde, in position number 2.  My son took it,
although it is actually two pictures merged into one by my scanner.  I'm new
at scanning so I don't know how it got all fuzzy and out of focus.

From the moment Stephen began outlining the game, I knew I would use that
picture.  Mostly, for me, it represents a very mysterious place, will forever
remain a mysterious place in fact.  Homes built in a cliff, in the middle of
a very dry arid place, yet obviously home to an ancient people... where did
they go, why?

Yet somehow the presence of those ancient people still resonates there.  The
mystery to me is tinged with sacredness, an awe at something I can feel that
is so beyond my limited existence.  For me, Psyber-L carries some of that
same feeling, especially as the commercialization of the Internet has taken
place so rapidly.

The odd part of getting this picture at all was that my family, brother and
sister and families, were all planning to meet in the Mesa Verde area for our
Memorial Day holiday.  As it turned out, too many difficulties got in my way
of going, despite the fact that I longed to go just to *feel* the sacredness
there.  My sister's RV broke down on the way, so her family didn't go either.
 And because we didn't go, my brother decided not to go either, so my 21 year
old son and a friend of his were the only ones to actually get there.

So that's the story of my picture/move.  Interestingly, of all the images,
Janelle's *coyote* most belongs with mine, at Mesa Verde, where coyote is a
powerful figure.

Sheryl

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 17:58:38 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <CMCPsych@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Sv:      [P] [COC GAME] Update Notes
MIME-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 07/07/2000 4:02:44 PM Mountain Daylight Time,
bbc@MAIL.DANBBS.DK writes:

> I see a lot of music in the coc game ,but............. as I told you I was
> going to
>  Roskilde festival for the 10 time and while pearl Jam was playing a
stormful
> raining
>  night ,,,,, oh I can nearly not bare to tell , 9 young people died of
> suffocation
>  in a crowd in front of the scene,right in front of my wery eyes
>   We were 90000 to the festival.  I was there together with my wife and
> children
>  and my freinds.

Bent, when I heard about the tragedy on the news, my first thought was, oh,
I'll bet that was the concert Bent had written about.  I am so sorry for this
to happen at an occasion of joy, but thankful that you and your family are
safe.

Part of the mystery of Psyber-L for me is that I am half a world away, but
based on the circle of Psyber-L, I thought of you and cared.  I hope you are
ok.

Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 18:19:31 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <CMCPsych@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: responding to reflections
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Robert, all...

In a message dated 07/10/2000 11:23:23 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
aigle@SK.SYMPATICO.CA writes:

> We are still in isolated
>  orbits around and empty centre in the image.  Perhaps that is what I sense
>  to be missing ... the core, the centre.  Looking at the circle I do see
that
>  it can expand to fit more individuals and for them to fit in randomly or
not
>  so randomly ...

I see the emptiness is the center, the core, too, Robert, somehow as I'm
viewing the circle of connections board again, I *want* to insert something
in the center, but I'm not sure what?  Maybe a sort of web, or picture of a
group of people, or maybe I am letting my imagination respond to the surface
shallow commercialization I've been feeling almost brainwashed with lately?
Or, shadowy figures, or, would Janelle's coyote maybe fit there?

>
>  What you have to say will fit, will always fit.  I think that I am too
harsh
>  a critic on my
>  "self" in terms of what I say and my presence, always searching for "worth"
>  for "worthiness."  I sense this in your questions here as well.  But then
>  again, I am likely just hearing echoes of my own thoughts rather than what
>  you say, what you intend on saying.

Robert, I believe we have this trait in common, this need to speak with
worthiness :)  It is a part of me that I hope I can let go a little, not to
have to say something *profound*, not to care if I say/write something
*inappropriate*, to go with my heart, to brave the fear of writing something
inane!

I suspect we are both too harsh and critical of ourselves!

Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 11 Jul 2000 18:31:50 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <CMCPsych@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS - notes
MIME-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 07/07/2000 11:36:13 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
hoon@APK.NET writes:

> all,
>
>  A few notes about the stage of reflection we're in right now.
>
>  One, You may contribute as many reflections as you wish. Probably most of
>  you know this already, but I wanted to make it explicit, again.
>
>  Two, anybody subscribed to Psyber-L may view the game board and contribute
>  to the reflections.
>

Stephen, where are the reflections posted?  My game board is the same as when
I first viewed it, with the *to live is to live in Walterworld* still in that
space.

Was Walterworld what was *meant* or was it Waterworld?  *Walterworld* felt
very right to me, sort of a take off on Waterworld, which does represent the
unconscious, which Walter has somehow been instrumental in developing here in
cyberspace.  The words in fact brought a smile to my face.

The picture though puzzled me then, but doesn't seem to now.  To live in
Walterworld or Waterworld, I would not picture the benches with people
sitting on them.

Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 13 Jul 2000 10:36:52 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Just about to fly home
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Psyber-llers,

A 36 hour journey begins in the morning, 22 in the air.  Hope to
catch up with the group in the air and to respond and update the
game when i am recovered!

Walter
______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 14 Jul 2000 10:57:41 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] non-participant response ...
In-Reply-To:  <00ce01bfea7f$05ac7e40$cc7ba58e@cyberie>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Robert writes,

"I am wondering how this is working out for those who didn't take part in
the initial setting of the game board."

It's impossible to know, of course, until such persons speak up. The
'silent' each have their own story and the vocal can only (and weakly,)
imagine what their level of engagement is on their end.

When people here speak up, it's like a hand hitting the table, otherwise we
get the sound of one hand clapping. . .I suppose.

This doesn't bother me Robert. The COC Game is opened up to reflections by
all others on Psyber-L but it is easy for me to qualify it as an
opportunity and yet is less surely so if the game is really of no interest.

Does such a game work better cordoned off from the main 'body' of the
group? This is a valuable question, even if it would be hard to isolate the
factors. What do you think?]

***

regards, Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 14 Jul 2000 10:50:42 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS - notes
In-Reply-To:  <c4.63f231f.269cfa56@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

All,

Sheryl, you wondered about updates of the game board. (Updates reflect
corrections of mistakes, the current state of the game, and requested
changes.)

Walter informs us he'll update the board when he gets back. I've asked
Walter to let me know if it is possible for me to update the site from my
end. I could post the whole site on my own server but I think the security
provision is valuable, and the minimal security on my end would simply be
that the site could not be accessed unless you knew it was there.

***

Getting the 'collaborative space' to work as quickly as possible is a
challenge for this kind of online play. One prospect for a future exercise
is for all players to have the ability to update. The optimal virtual mode
would be like the face-to-face mode: the dynamicism of the collaboration
would reflect the real time interactions.

Anybody doing experiential learning in structured ways wonders about such
stuff!

***

regards to all,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 14 Jul 2000 11:05:34 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC Game] the center as process? engagement?
In-Reply-To:  <00f201bfea92$b37cf960$cc7ba58e@cyberie>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

Robert, you wonder about what is at the centre, and what is the nature of
the core of the game.

So do I. I can only speak for my own working assumption. I assume the core
of the game is the process of the game. This is hard to depict. It might
look different to us all if the board itself were animated and could show
the positions moving about, fading in and out and in to each other, and
could depict the nature of a kind of dance.

In face-to-face work of this nature, the depictions aren't so static and to
observe a group exploring in this way is to better comprehend the process
at the very center.

However, the feeling of aspects being isolated from each other is apparent
to me. Determined engagement mitigates this, but, then, there are all the
other factors which have to do with what is possible and what qualifies
each person's engagement as the game unfolds itself.

***

regards,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Jul 2000 13:47:56 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Greg Marshkan <Marshkan@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] non-participant response ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Stephen,

I'm just now digging out of hundreds of emails which greeted me after return
from vacation (during which we experienced the death of my wife's father).
Needless to say, I have not been engaged in much else lately.

I did go to the web site for the game and found the images there interesting.
 But I must admit that I am used to playing games where there is some
expectation of outcomes, some rules, some defined objectives beforehand which
give the process and outcome a context and meaning.  This game seemed to
evolve without some of these, as far as I can tell.  And the outcome is as
baffling to me as the game itself was.  It is difficult to give the kind of
feedback you desire, because I, frankly, don't know what to say - about
either the process (in which I was unable to participate) or about the
outcome (which had some interesting and beautiful images, but leave me
somehow unable to respond).  Perhaps I am used to playing different kinds of
"games" - a limitation on my part.  I applaud the efforts of you and the
others who did participate and am eager to hear from the others what the
exercize meant to them.

Greg

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 15 Jul 2000 18:05:08 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] non-participant response ...
In-Reply-To:  <68.579d097.26a1fdcc@aol.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Greg, all,

You raise important issues about general structures for experiential game
playing. Definitions of the structure via explicit rules and
identifications of objectives and outcomes are imperatives.

If they are poorly defined, the game is, by definition (by virtue of the
lack of it!) hard to 'grab onto'. In my experience in this kind of play and
learning in the face-to-face mode, even if one person experiences
difficulty then it is incumbent for me to try to figure out what was
slippery or unclear or lacking.

Also to be figured out, (speaking here as instructional designer and
facilitator,) how do different learning styles/styles of engagement impact
on the ease or difficulty of play. (Then there is the impact of
facilitator's role; already I've made mistakes that have made the game much
more difficult.) Of course, there is an entire complex of factors to
consider.

At the same time, this is a category of 'gaming' which is built to be
somewhat strange. We have a 'beta testing' group here in Cleveland and what
used to be completely mysterious is now something they dive right into. In
fact, in a group with a great variety of *styles*, everybody has the
experience under their belt to be comfortable with what used to strange.

For example, *the outcome of the game is the playing of the game*. This is
faraway (from almost everybody's experience,) and far-out initially. So,
too is what really are the rules that underlie learning what *comes up*.
The rules are: intend, explore, discover, evaluate.

So, in the current game, if you review its presentation, (which isn't here
given as having been optimal or successful,) the participants built a board
out of what each resonated to and now, in the reflection phase, everybody
has the opportunity to discover what comes up out of what came up!

Ahh, the first game is the hardest. (Facilitator is humbled, yet, is
smiling.)

***

The guiding intention is found in the game's presentation. Perhaps, this
should go at the center of the board.)

My intention is to create a game that is about Psyber-L. It's intended to
evoke a spontaneously soulful snapshot of the group.

This 'picture' is evoked out of a three step process that simply requires
participants to engage the game, implement a step that is a combination of
setting their own intention and hunting for and then gathering one piece of
data, submitting it to me via email, and then, reflecting on the
completed-at-once game board I compile from the submissions.

A game like this is in kinship to how one might work with a dream, or the
product of active imagination. It's also similar to intuitive creativity as
it might come about if one were to spontaneously write a poem or play an
instrument or finger paint.

It's very similar to glass bead 'gaming', which some here have some
experience. Charles might be able to enrich our picture of just how
different these kinds of activities are from what we're accustomed to.

***

Most of the vehicles for exploration were not made explicit in the
presentation of this game. I'll mention a few: amplification, association,
connection by way of similarity or contrast, synchronous data, (in this
game an example is the appearance of a sitar and guitar,) and, crucially,
simply what bursts forth for any reason.

Confusion, feeling difficulty, 'forbiddingness', not finding anything to
grab onto, (etc.) all count as valuable aspects of this snapshot; in other
words, even the negative response is no less an outcome than other
responses.  The soundness of the design of the game may be called into
question. yet, every response is part of what comes up during the game and,
even if this is seemingly esoteric, every response, even the non-response
is part of the outcome.

***

I hope this helps, Greg, I would not present this game the same way a
second time around. Still, I feel the board to be very rich in implication.
Easy for me, ENFP who's played this way for years. That the board doesn't
offer much implication for some participant(s) is absolutely correct, too.

You wrote, "I, frankly, don't know what to say - about either the process
(in which I was unable to participate) or about the outcome (which had some
interesting and beautiful images, but leave me somehow unable to respond)."

I find this very valuable.

Does it have to do anything with Psyber-L? My own view? Sometimes email
discussion groups evoke this very same response in me. Maybe, as an aspect
of our collaborative snapshot is the recognition: at times Psyber-L seems
like a game with not very clear rules and not much of a sense of a progress
toward a definite outcome.

Yes, it's a leap, but that's what came up for me!

regards,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 17 Jul 2000 06:46:48 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Sv:      [P] [COC GAME] Update Notes
In-Reply-To:  <001e01bfe85f$4b78ac40$a1db61d4@oemcomputer>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Bent, all,

> as I told you I was going to
> Roskilde festival for the 10 time and while pearl Jam was playing a stormful raining
> night ,,,,, oh I can nearly not bare to tell , 9 young people died of suffocation
> in a crowd in front of the scene,right in front of my wery eyes

I am home, and it is early in the morning before i go to work...
I am usually a night owl but am still operating on UK time, so
was up at 5.00am.

Life has been full on... travel is a big thing to do!  This is
the first chance i have had to read the posts (more about that
later) and I was moved deeply by your experience, what a sad
thing to happen.

You write about your grief so beautifully Bent... thank you.

I read about sad things in the paper and they rarely move me.
Your sharing here got my tears going Bent.  Part of it is that
right in the middle of reflections about music and resonance in
this group... where there seems to be no crowding at all is this
sad story of music where for a moment anyway, there was no
resonance... but suffocation.  I can hear Pearl Jam in my head as
I read, and that adds to the intensity considerably.


Love to all,


Walter








______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 18 Jul 2000 20:52:51 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Monday Update 2
In-Reply-To:  <0vv3ns0qmj583kp4asb6uhgasphe5psbn3@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

I was incorrect. The board does reflect the changes to positions #3 and #9.
Perhaps, it's due for some more perusal.


music, anyone?

***

peace. Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 18 Jul 2000 20:49:52 -0500
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC Game] Monday update
In-Reply-To:  <0vv3ns0qmj583kp4asb6uhgasphe5psbn3@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

I have to apologize for the lack of an update to the board. It's out of my
hands. The first update from 7-9 was posted, but nothing after that
including critical corrections to the board. Meanwhile, the reflections
have stopped.

Participants may wish to give feedback about their desire to have more time
to reflect, engage, re-engage. I'll use that info over the next few days to
suggest a closing date for the game.

***

What's going on in creative field of the board? What wishes to emerge?

***

regards to all,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 19 Jul 2000 12:44:46 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Welcomes
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Welcome back Anita Konkka from 7 weeks of travel in Europe!

Anita, you sent me an impressive lists of names of places where
you have been.  It would be great to hear about your travels.
But rest up first... I know how it feels, takes time to settle
back in!

~~~

Welcome to Iurie Malai from Chisinau, Moldova.

I am about to get out the atlas!  Good to have you on board.
Your country and areas of interest evoke my own interest and
curiosity... I hope you find your way into our group (23 or so at
present).  I hope people welcome you!  Sometimes they do.
Whatever happens, I can assure you this is a caring and committed
group, with a respect for each other, process, and the psyche and
the riches through being connected through the internet.

Looking forward to your participation.

Walter


~~~

Here is the intro from Iurie Malai.

|  Hi,
|  This is Iurie Malai from Chisinau, Moldova. I am very interested to learn
|  about the psyche in cyberspace.
|
|  Iurie Malai, Senior Lecturer
|  Faculty of Psychology and Special Education
|  Ion Creanga Moldova State Pedagogical University



______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 19 Jul 2000 13:13:55 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] Monday Update 2
In-Reply-To:  <v04220801b59aba0af4f7@[207.54.160.97]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Stephen, all,

Yes i did update them though have not announced it to the list...
jet lag!

I apologise for these delays.  I am back at work, and strangely
am now regularly at the machine... present here!  Great to have
you do these updates, it is a little circuitous the way we are
doing it, via me, but it feels right to do it this way.  I cant
imagine any more delays, apart from our difference in sleep
times.

Stephen, I neglected to mention that it is ok to add my
reflections to the online record.

> I was incorrect. The board does reflect the changes to positions #3 and #9.
> Perhaps, it's due for some more perusal.

Anita and Iurie Malai, we have, with Stephen's facilitation been
exploring the group in a Circle of Connection... the results of
our efforts are on the web at:

http://www.psybernet.co.nz/circle/

username = psyber
password = circle

The access is open to any member of this group.


Walter.

______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 20 Jul 2000 10:06:44 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      The WWW, no screen!
Comments: To: group-l@lists.groupsense.co.nz
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Dear friends,

Here are some notes I poured out... on my Palm, with its new
keyboard, ironically while at the new Starbucks in Christchurch
which opened while I was away.

Walter

~~~

I could not easily enter into virtual life while travelling, more
accuratly I could not control my virtual life, it was outside the
machine!

Here is why:

Preparation, packing, tickets, money, arrange this and that and
more. Goodbyes. On the plane it is suddenly easy to watch the
movie... I am tired, there is Straight Story, it is movie with
merit.

I need sleep.  I snatch some.  They bring menus and food.

There is time with Kate... we have spent days busy and rushed
getting away and the plane is a capsule in which we connect.

More sleep.

Suddenly, after immigration, customs all with their associated
bits of paper, jet lagged, we are negotiating sign posts... which
bus to get to pick up the rental car?  Documentation for
licences, insurance, creditcards... Next time will be easy, the
first time it involves reading ALL the signs... virtuality
attached to reality bangs at me.  And it does not always
correlate... sometimes the signs do not say clearly what they
mean.

For example, to use a NZ example as I can't recall the numeropus
OS ones, the sign in Bealy Avenue that says Kaikoura... is
accurate but confusing.  It really means 'This way to go North up
the coast' but how is a stranger to know that? I experience
stress reading the virtuality delivered by the world not the
world wide web.

Then dyslexically driving on the right of the road on the free
ways keep us glued to atoms not bits... as much as we can, though
that is not easy to do. From MAP to to sign post to freeway, map-
signposts-freeway, from virtuality to reality.

But the real thing happens when we meet people ... Rebecca and
her social social world... talk, talk, talk... no time to record
to reflect but only time to be in the immediacy of life, caught
in a swirl of hospitality which includes a running commetary on
the environment - including the gliterati who have residences in
this neigbourhood.

Money looks different.  Its value is strange.

More brochures.  Universal Studio.  A place where what were once
only stories have a smitchen of physicality... the Pycho house,
the Jaws shark.

Getty museaum, beautiful artifacts, paintings with glowing names
van Gogh, Rembrant. Items snatched in years past from their
original context, which is now provided by signs, short
descripotions on a plague on the wall or via the audio player.
See the item, read the comments, hear the comments both of which
are informative, enriching but which I instinctivley distrust.

Saw Charlton Heston, an icon in the flesh looking old looking at
a Monet.

A drive through Hollywood by night... neon icon after neon icon
sliding past... Texaco, Coke, Burger King and a shimmering mass
of others I have photos of but cant recall.  Were we going
anywhere?  Were we lost? I was too exausted to care.

More free ways, aroplanes, Sarbucks, brochures, tickes money
exchanges, money machines which worked or not.

Eating out Menus, not pull down ones but they are on the table on
the walls, on black boards etc.  Do we tip here, do we order at
the table do we pay and eat or eat and pay do we eat in out etc,

More sleep... or sleep deprivation... time is all screwed up the
clock face does not link to the body clock.

London. After fiddlingf with cell phone number prefixes, maps and
place names I meet Josh and his social network! Talking, viewing,
eating, sleeping.

I finally get time to set up the machine, the wires, to fail at
getting the plugs to work, to fail to get the International
roaming to work,  I get a virus warning I reboot isolate it
reboot etc.  I have the digital camera to unload.  I need to
vacate the desk while Josh uses his machine... I call NZ direct,
download 500 emails.

What day is it? What will we do? Where will we meet? Negotiations
about the day. Read the brocures, negotiate the tube and the
tickets and the time.

Tate modern. Bits of body, slaughter, meaninlessnes, violence
apathy, naked existence, godlessness, absurdity, sureallisn,
meaninglessness, confusion, pain ... what a century we have just
had.

Wow, that was another thing off the monoploly board.
Whitechappel, Park Lane, Liverpool Station, Picaddilly... The
NZers knew what was on the Monopoly board and what was not, the
Londoners did not!

6.00am to Heathrow on the tube to reconnect with Kate who has
been in LA for a week longer than me.

Graduation ceremony for Josh. Installations at the exhibition.
Albert Hall, tube tube tube tube.

Sights to see, the UK motorways Stonehenge interface to the
cosmos, Dorset, B&B, maps, roads, menus, brochures, tickets
signposts planes sleep deprivation, phone calls LAX, movies,
Auckland delays, home ....




______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 20 Jul 2000 09:40:13 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: The WWW, no screen!
In-Reply-To:  <gj5cnskh5nrm241eoucaeendl1or97hds1@4ax.com>
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Walter,

Egad!

Judith

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=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 20 Jul 2000 19:55:20 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Thursday Update
In-Reply-To:  <v04220801b59aba0af4f7@[207.54.160.97]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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all,

My suggestion today is that the Circle of Connections Game come to a close
on Sunday.

The web pages have finally been updated (http://www.psybernet.co.nz/circle/
l:psyber p:circle), so if anyone wishes to re-engage it, they might also
require and ask for more time. This would be fine with me. Otherwise, given
that the last reflection was made on Saturday, and many other reflections
have evoked no further responses, it is apparent this is a good time to
suggest a closing date.

Feedback would be appreciated.

I will -later- make my own reflection about the board as an act of closure,
when the closure date is set.

regards,

Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 21 Jul 2000 22:24:44 +0300
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Anita Konkka <anitak@MEGABAUD.FI>
Subject:      Back on the list
In-Reply-To:  <gj5cnskh5nrm241eoucaeendl1or97hds1@4ax.com>
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Hello Walter and all,

You wrote  that you couldn't  easily enter into the virtual life
while  travelling.   Neither me!
The real life  was so full of  new people, experiences, places.  I visited
in 19 cities  Europe, and in every  cities I was  searching
for   Internet  cafes  with my younger colleagues.  The hunt  took often
much time.  I  had made a deal with a Finnish  newspaper, that  I'll send
them by  e-mail my  travelling diary  from different countries.  I was
travelling on the  train 7000 km with  105  writers  from 43 European
countries.  The  project was  called Literaturexpress Europe 2000.
    I  have been at home  4 bight, but  still  I' m wondering - when
I  awake at night -  where I am. What country, what city, what
hotel?   During  the trip I   lost my sense of time  -  I never knew  which
day it was -  monday, Tuesday, Wednesday? and so  on.  Then I lost my sense
of money.  I had to  exchange  currency in  11 countries!  At last
my  sense of reality began to  disappear, I  was like  in
the  dream-state.  And  now  I  try to return back  to  reality, back
to  everyday life.  It is so  hard.

What  is going here?  I  downloaded the game  page
and  the  messages,  but   still I  cannot understand.   Could, you
Stephen,  write a  short resume about  the game and its  stages?

Welcome  Lurie Malai from Chisinau!  My  oldest cousin is  living in
Moldova, but  I don't know where there. I  have never  met her, I  don't
even  remember her name. I only  know that my  aunt  moved  years ago
from  Northern Russia to  live  with her.  My  aunt died some  years ago. I
met her  when she visited in  Finland in  the  seventies.

Anita

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 22 Jul 2000 11:14:51 EDT
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Sheryl Garner <CMCPsych@AOL.COM>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
MIME-Version: 1.0
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COC game players, all...

I saw that Stephen is closing the game as of Sunday, but I will have to leave
a little sooner since I am going out of town for 2 weeks, hopefully for some
soul healing get away time.

I want to say that I am a little disappointed about the game reflections, or
lack of them, just to gather others' responses, impressions, feelings, and to
reflect them back to my own.  But I'm only a little disappointed because I
thought the COC game was a beautiful experience, short, yet thoughtful,
leaving me with maybe a little more and a little less understanding of what
we seek from Psyber-L as a group.

One of my first impressions as I viewed the pictures, which I did not mention
in my first reflections was as an *OH!  We all want the same thing!*  But
when I thought further, it seemed like a very ridiculous impression, based on
absolutely nothing.  I even looked for some kind of theme that might have
emerged to give me that impression, like the commonality in many of man-made
structures or the wording of the intentions.  But those were pretty loose
themes.  So what I did was talk myself right out of the *we all want the same
thing* intuition.

That impression based mostly on feeling lingers, though, and I think that
will probably be what remains in my soul or psyche, that we all want the same
thing, we just aren't sure what it may be.

I wish the COC game to be meaningful for all, I'll *see* you all in a couple
of weeks, and thank you, Stephen for the opportunity you've provided us with.

Sheryl

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 09:54:27 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] Thursday Update
In-Reply-To:  <v04220800b59d3f95f89d@[207.54.160.43]>
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Stephen,

> My suggestion today is that the Circle of Connections Game come to a close
> on Sunday.

Sounds OK to me.  I have in the midst of my journey enjoyed the
journey here.  It seems it was short and sweet as intended...
though protracted through my almost total and unexpected
inability to stay in touch.

> Feedback would be appreciated.
>
> I will -later- make my own reflection about the board as an act of closure,
> when the closure date is set.

I look forward to that.

When you say "feedback" are you thinking about discussion about
the game process?  Its design and so on?  That is distinct from
the reflections in the game itself.  I think that would be a good
thing to do. How we work with the psyche here is always of
interest to me and important as we take on facilitation roles in
other groups.


Walter
______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 10:00:26 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
In-Reply-To:  <4e.8a77d21.26ab146b@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Sheryl

Have a good trip away, perhaps you will see this before you go.

It is Sunday here, and the last day of the game as it were.  I
have not been disappointed. It has been very quiet here and this
event and the reflections have affirmed our existence and
strengths and it has been great for me that this has happened
without a lot from me - it is sometimes a fear of mine that this
whole space is too dependent on me.

> So what I did was talk myself right out of the *we all want the same
> thing* intuition.

> That impression based mostly on feeling lingers, though, and I think that
> will probably be what remains in my soul or psyche, that we all want the same
> thing, we just aren't sure what it may be.

Perhaps the very act of the contributions... the common
participation revealed our common desire... to participate
meaningfully and soulfully.

All for now,

Walter

______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 13:44:26 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Re: Back on the list
In-Reply-To:  <4.3.1.0.20000721205907.00a78c50@megabaud.fi>
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Anita, all,

What a trip! I find I can enter into your experience more easily
as I have just been doing something similar.

> The  project was  called Literaturexpress Europe 2000.

Was the project a success from a literature point of view?
Strangely I have a sense that travel is not really conducive to
writing.  Maybe for some but not for me. The trip i have just
been on grew out of Josh's graduation, and so was planned around
that... Kate and i have been planning one for ourselves due in a
few years time.  Right now I just dont know how to do that!  Kate
likes to go sight seeing... I prefer sitting in cafes reading and
writing.  One thought i had was renting a cheap place in europe
somewhere as a base and I could just stay put.  Perhaps an
exchange of homes with someone?  We have a nice home in central
Christchurch and a holiday house in the hills!

> And  now  I  try to return back  to  reality, back
> to  everyday life.  It is so  hard.

I feel the same.  It has taken a full week to feel half normal.
That makes for a month of disorientation!

~~~

> What  is going here?  I  downloaded the game  page
> and  the  messages,  but   still I  cannot understand.   Could, you
> Stephen,  write a  short resume about  the game and its  stages?

You may wish to explore the instructions on the web archives of
this list.

But on a thumbnail it is this:

We each sent an image and a sentence to Stephen on the theme:
"What is our wish for Psyber-L" Stephen made them up into a web
page which was then revealed to all and we have been reflecting
on the result.

~~~

> Welcome  Lurie Malai from Chisinau!

Anita, I am glad you added your welcome!  It helps a lot I think
to make this a place with energy if we attend to welcomes and
initiatives from others.

~~~

I am back on the list too... though still conscious of being in
reentry mode... I still have a swag of messages on the
answerphone to attend to for example. We are in the midst of a
very relaxing weekend in our holiday house, and listening to the
music from the Insider - Music by Lisa Gerrard and Pieter Bourke.
Often i dont like soundtracks but this one is great... I thought
while watching the movie how much I liked the music!


Another thing i have been doing more of lately, and can do more
thoroughly now is online psychotherapy.  I have found the process
really worthwhile recently.  Did i mention that i have a new URL
for the purpose of strengthening that aspect of my work?
http://www.psychotherapist.co.nz  There is nothing there apart
from a link to the old pages, but this is a project i want to
develop.  [PS: I am not offering online psychotherapy to members
of this Psyber-L group... I see this more or less confidential
space more as one where i can reflect on this work (without
naming names of course) and I am clear about the boundary].

Best wishes,


Walter
______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 22 Jul 2000 22:54:14 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Saturday Update; Anita, Iurie
In-Reply-To:  <b5iinsgaeerp1msa523d5so8h80254a7f0@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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all,

Our game participants include everybody here, Anita. You're playing whether
you know it or not!

Welcome back. I like hearing your voice, especially hearing it upon your
return.

***

The board is confusing; life is confusing. Maybe one figures it out the
same way?

Look at it? What comes up? What wants to live and be lived? If the board
should issue a call, what might your answer be? (I'll append the game
presentation/instructions to this post.)

(That's the game we've all been playing since early June.)

Anita, I'd really like to know if you see anything interesting arise out of
the interplay of stuff on the board.

***

Sunday the game formally closes, but any further commentary is welcome
after that point until we move on.

***

Walter asks,
>
>When you say "feedback" are you thinking about discussion about
>the game process?  Its design and so on?

Tomorrow, Sunday here in Cleveland, Ohio, I will contribute a reflection.
It may or may not be the last one. But, it will be the last one by me.

Judith and I met with the game board on a print out between us, on
Thursday. It served as a kind of debriefing of how the game was presented
and facilitated, and, also provoked new reflections as we considered the
board anew and again. There's a lot there. I'm hoping Judith will
contribute her reflection here in the next day. What we helped each other
see will inform some of what I will contribute.

A discussion or any feedback about the process and experience of
participation and engagement would be valuable both generally, and
particularly as it bears upon my own comprehensions about the operation and
facilitation of games like this in psyberia. (For newcomers, Psyberia is an
affectionate coinage describing the territory we inhabit here on Psyber-L.)

***

Iurie Malai,

Welcome to Psyber-L. It's a unique outpost. My own view of our own
collaborative endeavor about  the "psyche in psyberspace" is that we create
an experiential inquiry along personal, 'soulful' lines of investigation
with the material at hand; and, this is weighted toward the facts of our
lives more than what our studious or scholarly preoccupations concern. This
is just the way I see it of course!

hoping you'll get something out of being among us and with us,

regards from the USA,

Stephen

The original presentation of the Circle of Connections Game, from 16 June,
2000.

The game: (called) THE CIRCLE OF CONNECTIONS

Introduction. My intention is to create a game that is about Psyber-L. It's
intended to evoke a spontaneously soulful snapshot of the group.

This 'picture' is evoked out of a three step process that simply requires
participants to engage the game, implement a step that is a combination of
setting their own intention and hunting for and then gathering one piece of
data, submitting it to me via email, and then, reflecting on the
completed-at-once game board I compile from the submissions.


====
The game's procedure.

Step One. The facilitator will set the collective intention for the game
and present the game's procedure as well as its game board format.

INITIALIZING INTENTION: This game is intended to *resolve* a soulful
spontaneous snapshot of Psyber-L.


Step Two. Each participant is to discover, gather and submit via email *to:
hoon@apk.net*, two pieces of data:

(a) written: a one sentence intention, or wish, or question, that best
expresses -in the moment- the participant's idea about what is next for,
or, is to be learned about Psyber-L.

(b) discovered: an image, or picture, or depiction of a symbol, that in
some way resonates with this moment of engagement of the game.



Step Three: All submissions are to be submitted to the facilitator who will
then compile the submissions on the game board.

The submissions will be positioned by the facilitator in the order that
they are received. The game board will be set *all at once* in this way.



Step Four: Reflection. The game board will be revealed to both participants
and observers of the game. For this reflection, the group intention is
along the lines of: "What comes up for you? What do you see? What
connections do you sense? What resonates for you?" (etc.).
====


The reflection is to be documented as an email thread in the Psyber-L front
channel.

One rule for this experiential game, no one has to do anything they don't
feel comfortable doing.

That's it, although, I now give you a few clarifying notes.

***

notes


1. The participants will not be identified on the board. (However,
participants will be identified by their participation as persons agree to
join.)

2. Connections may be made between any positions on the board.

3. The randomizing procedure will set the first received submission at the
12 o'clock position and move clockwise as submissions are received.

4. The facilitator will set the board within 48 hours of his obtaining all
the submissions. [important: both pieces of data need to be submitted using
email. The facilitator will deal with capturing and conversion of graphic
media in cases where it is necessary. Otherwise, an email with (a) and (b)
attached to it will serve as the submission.]

5. The board will be located at Psyber-L's web publishing space and be
available to all subscribers to Psyber-L.

6. The initial intention of the game <<This game is intended to *resolve* a
soulful spontaneous snapshot of Psyber-L>> to be is placed at the center of
the board.

7. There will be a three day period to enroll participants. Next,
participants will have three days to discover, gather and submit to the
facilitator their two pieces of data. (Step two) The game board will be set
within two days of the receipt of all submissions. The period of reflection
will last as long as reflecting sustains itself; anticipated 2 days to ???.

8. Probably the most challenging part of the game is the participants'
formulation of an intention. Intention fuels the game and so they work best
when they are true expressions of where one is at in the moment and also
'hold' a kind of questing spirit to learn in what ways the parts here on
Psyber-L make up a dynamically creative *whole*.

***

Let's begin with two initial parameters: one, let's tag posts about the
game in the subject line [COC GAME] and, two, let's see if we can reach 8+
participants by Sunday midnight, my time US:est. We have four, so far.

If we get 8+ participants, I'll follow up with a short note about *hunting
and gathering* and set step two's duration.

Any questions should be directed front channel.

Thanks to all who already have, are considering, or will now or soon,
choose to give this game a shot.



What's the group about? This game provides no definitive answer, yet, like
the best snapshop, it, God(s) willing, resolves something soulfully
irrevocable and true about the group.

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 12:06:12 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
In-Reply-To:  <bk5knsk1hoflqajmcdvn0qhrh7scd9qtj3@4ax.com>
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All,

here is my second reflection which came up when Stephen and I had our
weekly meeting...it grows out of Greg's reflection wondering about
what the game outcome was suppose to be

By calling the COC a "game" a dissonance is created...we all come to
the event with preconceived assumptions about "game"...Stephen
inadvertently created dissonance by saying there are no right or
wrong answers...which I wonder if this led to Robert's and Sheryl's
concern over responding...just a conjecture...in effect Stephen's set
of rules made "game" more dissonant, unexamined assumptions created
some confusion as everyone engaged...Stephen has assumptions about
"game" which are not in alignment with the cultural norm of
"game"...he is not about outcome..."game" is about outcome...he is
about Play as in funjoymysteryengagement, not about playing as in
"game", what moves will get me to the desired outcome...

I related an experience of playing with my son when he was about 7
(he's 28 now)...there was a "game" called the "un-game"...there was
no outcome...it was about the experience...it was non
competitive...there were no right or wrong answers, only your answers
which were right for you...in our competitive US world it faded...

There's more but the British Open is heating up.

Blessings,
Judith

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 12:03:30 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
In-Reply-To:  <bk5knsk1hoflqajmcdvn0qhrh7scd9qtj3@4ax.com>
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All,

It is Sunday here and the final reflection No. l for me (in between
watching the British Open)...

This is all in the context of my posting about "staying"...

The image that has stayed with me during the COC experience has been
the empty benches...when Walter posted his traveling experience it
resonated to a deep knowing... in Psyber-L there are always comings
and going...I can feel the absense of various peoples' energies when
they are "away"...the circle of connection is continually broken
energetically creating a lack of center if you will...was it you
Robert who commented that the game board circle didn't have anything
in the center? energetically we are always in a state of
disconnectedness seeking connectedness, continuous energetic
reorganization...I have experienced this most dramatically with the
two dream events when people move into another space and form
connection leaving those of us who remain with more "space" between
us...there is always silence when the dream events end and people
"return"...it takes time to energetically create the connection...

I learned during my on-line experience with my PhD program years ago
that I was having trouble keeping everyone in my "class" straight...I
read kinesthetically and when i examined my assumptions I found that
distance was at the root of my confusion...I assumed since we were
all at a distance we weren't connected energetically...but with
non-locality this is found to be incorrect...what I had to
consciously do was to expand my space if you will to encompass
everyone...I do this with Psyber-l making it encompass the
world...when I do this I am able to "feel" each person's energy and
thus recognize them...

Western culture as a norm doesn't recognize the "unseen" and
therefore we tend to say it's body language, tone of voice,
etc...things which can be seen...here in cyberspace bringing energy
into our consciousness if only to act "as if" it were true, would be
interesting to me...

Parenthetically, I feel that part of the reason for our grapling with
Walter's role is that on an energetic level we unconsciously are
aware of needing someone holding the center

Well, I continue to learn here which is why I "stay" ala Janell's contribution

In gratefulness to all for their "staying"
Judith

____________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 13:18:53 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
In-Reply-To:  <v04210112b5a0eb1bc85d@[207.54.160.223]>
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Judith writes:

> Stephen has assumptions about "game" which are
> not in alignment with the cultural norm of "game"...
> he is not about outcome..."game" is about outcome...

S'funny, Judith, but when Wittgenstein wanted an example of a word whose
meanings are way too wide to fit under any one umbrella definition, he
chose "game" as his exemplary word.  It really beggars definition!  In
German, game and play (spiel, spielen) are virtually the same word, and
game / play thus includes soccer and Shakespeare -- and such things as the
"play" that a loose tooth has, it's wiggle-room, so to speak.  What's
interesting is that the different meanings are not exactly groupable into
neat subcategories, but seem to shift into new configurations like
quicksilver.

Sooooo, this has been a longwinded way to say that mebbe Stephen is not so
wrong, that it's doubtful that we can have much of a "cultural norm" about
this ultra slippery word, that game is play is freedom is ruleset is
childlike is masterful...

Regards,

--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Senior Analyst, The Arlington Institute <chasc@arlingtoninstitute.org>
HipBone Games http://home.earthlink.net/~hipbone

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:52:12 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
In-Reply-To:  <l03130300b5a0d69a82f7@[63.20.81.111]>
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charles,

All the games I know of (which addmittedly may be limited) keep score
tho chess gets to check mate, no scoring along the way if you don't
count taking men, and if keeping score isn't about outcome, then why
do games keep score...just play for the fun of it, no score... not to
say that playing the game can't be fun tho I'm not sure David Duval
was having too much fun in the 17th hole bunker which cost him second
place and alot of money and prestige...or that the son and wife of
the man who was killed by another parent at his son's game because of
a call by the referee was playing for fun...here in cleveland we have
had "quiet" sundays where parents aren't allow to say anything at a
child's game...I don't know what game Wittgenstein played or plays or
if you consider him the norm, certainly tho there are German speaking
people in cleveland, English is our norm

sorry, charles, but my reaction to your comments is that I'm being
patronized...I never said Stephen was "wrong" just that he was making
assumptions which were unexamined...and I will stand beside my
assumptions with the caveat "popular" cultural norm...

Judith

>Judith writes:
>
>> Stephen has assumptions about "game" which are
>> not in alignment with the cultural norm of "game"...
>> he is not about outcome..."game" is about outcome...
>
>S'funny, Judith, but when Wittgenstein wanted an example of a word whose
>meanings are way too wide to fit under any one umbrella definition, he
>chose "game" as his exemplary word.  It really beggars definition!  In
>German, game and play (spiel, spielen) are virtually the same word, and
>game / play thus includes soccer and Shakespeare -- and such things as the
>"play" that a loose tooth has, it's wiggle-room, so to speak.  What's
>interesting is that the different meanings are not exactly groupable into
>neat subcategories, but seem to shift into new configurations like
>quicksilver.
>
>Sooooo, this has been a longwinded way to say that mebbe Stephen is not so
>wrong, that it's doubtful that we can have much of a "cultural norm" about
>this ultra slippery word, that game is play is freedom is ruleset is
>childlike is masterful...
>
>Regards,
>
>--
>Charles
>Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
>*
>Senior Analyst, The Arlington Institute <chasc@arlingtoninstitute.org>
>HipBone Games http://home.earthlink.net/~hipbone
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
>here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 19:41:46 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
In-Reply-To:  <v04210114b5a11637e917@[207.54.160.223]>
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Judith:

> sorry, charles, but my reaction to your comments is that
> I'm being patronized...

This is the most important part of your post, for me, since reflects a
"hurt" in the conversation -- so I'm pulling it to the top and dealing with
it first.

I never intended to patronize you, and I'm sorry if I seemed to: I quoted
Wittgenstein because he's a fascinating thinker and book-friend, not to
patronize.  After reading your posts here for several years, I tend to
think of you in collegial terms, as a valued friend, certainly not someone
I would wish to demean.  My apologies in any case.

> All the games I know of (which addmittedly may be limited)
> keep score tho chess gets to check mate, no scoring along
> the way if you don't count taking men, and if keeping score
> isn't about outcome, then why do games keep score...

I think my point is probably the same as yours, Judith, as well as being
opposite to it in some ways [as Oxford and Cambridge are opposites that are
almost identical].  You're addressing your sense that the norm tends to
exclude "play for the fun of it", I'm suggesting the norm can include it.
Both of us want language to be used in a manner that's normative enough to
facilitate mutual understanding.

> just play for the fun of it, no score...

The catch is what we think the word "game" (normally) means.  If you define
games in such a way as to exclude "just play for the fun of it, no score",
then you'll also be able to say "All the games I know of keep score"...
whereas if you define games to include "just play for the fun of it, no
score", you can say "I know games that keep score and games that don't".

Noah Falstein, who was President of the Computer Game Developers
Association at the time, wrote once:

::  I am prompted to comment that there are two general
::  classifications of game playing, playing in order to win
::  (competitively) and playing for the sheer joy of play.

I think that's a clear enough indication both that playing to win is the
most usual meaning (basically your position), and also that playing for
sheer joy is also part of the norm (basically mine).   My own HipBone
Games, in fact, are designed *specifically* so that you can keep score
[competitive play], pretend to keep score [mock-competitive play with
cooperative intent, which turns out to be hilarious] or not keep score
[collaborative and aesthetic play].

> I never said Stephen was "wrong" just that he was
> making assumptions which were unexamined...

I'm suggesting this might fall under the rubric of "slighly different
senses of what the word normally means" rather than "unexamined
assumptions"...

*

However, whichever way we see it, to me the fascinating point is that
Wittgenstein -- one of the most brilliant minds of the last century --
found the word "game" and its meanings so extraordinarily hard to capture
under a single definition that he used it as his example of fluidity in the
meaning of words.  For myself as a game designer, one time editor-at-large
of a game developer's magazine, and person who is still hoping to write a
book about games and play and how they're at the heart of creativity one of
these days, that's a big deal... and one that I wanted to share with you.
It's what I think of as a "beloved fact", I collect such things, and I'm
offering it as a gift.

Hoping my first para has straightened out any problems, and that we're on
good terms again even if seeing things from different perspectives
(something to rejoice in, I believe),

Regards,

--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Senior Analyst, The Arlington Institute <chasc@arlingtoninstitute.org>
HipBone Games http://home.earthlink.net/~hipbone

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 19:51:29 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Game / Un-Game
In-Reply-To:  <l03130302b5a1331c419e@[63.20.83.53]>
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all,

Charles writes in response to Judith,

>> I never said Stephen was "wrong" just that he was
>> making assumptions which were unexamined...
>
>I'm suggesting this might fall under the rubric of "slighly different
>senses of what the word normally means" rather than "unexamined
>assumptions"...

Taken out of context this may or may not be true, Charles. But, since it
specifically had a context, given that context, it is definitely not true.

This is absolutely crucial to understand. I'd like to approach this with
the intention of making Judith's and my work together more substantial for
everybody, but, in amazing ways (to me) this misunderstanding hits home
with great synchronous effect. It is germane to understanding the nature of
the way experiential 'games' are designed and used in our work. Thus,
obviously, this has a crucial bearing on the Circle of Connections Game in
the sense that it is a development rooted in our work.

***

Let me flash for a second what your relevantmisunderstanding got me
thinking about today. I got to further reflection on stuff crucial
(reminder: in my own view,) to experiential learning, as we practice it.

Late this afternoon I got to recollecting my experience coaching college
volleyball; and, having watched on TV Tiger Woods win the British Open,
hypothesizing about the nature of his superiority; recalling the ways in
which my own assumptions interface in various arenas; thinking about the
difference between teachers and teachings; (once again) reflecting on the
dynamic relationship *in a process* between context, empathy, presence,
assumptions and the practical, as well as my reflections on the COC Game.

(Phew! ...the thought life of an intuitive!)

***

I hold the following working hypothesis: assumptions are practical
precisely in the way they work in a specific context. This doesn't mean
this hypothesis (or any other one,) is not valid generally or abstractly,
(it may or may not be,) but that the most precise test is with respect to a
specific context. Here's another working hypothesis: In experiential
learning, the most practical test must be with respect to a specific
context.

I'm going to get at this in a roundabout way (in a follow-up post,) simply
because in the flow of my jamming here this allows me to at least startle
myself, again, with the synchronistic imports of some of the data that
entered my world today. As always, I'm appreciative of all who indulge me a
bit of play.

However, I'll cut to the chase immediately and then go around and
overboard. Charles, the context out of which the word *game* came up, was
the brief moment of debriefing Judith and I engaged in on Friday morning.
(In case some do not know, Judith and I are professional partners in
squareONE:experiential toolmakers and we both collaborate on this project,
our lifes' work, really, here in Cleveland, Ohio; plus we're dedicated
Psyberian explorers here.) Furthermore, the context had to do with what the
word *game* means in the context of The Circle of Connections Game and the
design and facilitation of the game, and, more generally, in our work.

When Judith and I subject our, her, my work to our own scrutiny, what we do
is examine assumptions, learn what assumptions were not examined, and try
to scrutinize how those assumptions 'interplayed' with all the other
assumptions (in as far as we comprehended them,) in the field of 'play'.

And yes, this is very much a process of using one set of assumptions to
examine other sets of assumptions! The key to doing this is, (at least as I
know it from my own experience,) is rooting this scrutiny in the actual
context. It is entirely impractical for our purposes to do it any other way.

***

A conundrum of instructional design (for experiential learning purposes) as
well as simply talking about this kind of game playing, our work, and the
actual context(s), is that much of what I just expressed is implicit and
for all practical purposes, hidden.

Let me turn this into a qualifying reflection on The Circle of Connections
Game. *What everybody has been involved in no matter what level of personal
engagement they effected with respect to this exercise over the past month
or so is a kind of cutting edge play.*

Quicksilver.

***

Here's another assumption I make as a designer: "Much of what people assume
the game is about or should be about may be very difficult to apply."

Implicit: a 'game' may be designed to shake a bit the assumptions
participants take to the game. Generally: experiential learning is about
transforming the 'scheme of meaning'; alternately: working assumptions. In
other words, such a game is a way of experiencing one's own examination of
assumptions. Charles, this may seem remedial to you.

***

My point is that the word *game* came up, as Judith stated clearly, in a
discussion about my assumptions in using the word to describe and present
the COC Game. I could myself explore in numbing detail the meaning of words
in terms of literature, philosophy, religion, heck the whole history of
ideas (upon which I am foologant enough to believe I have a slight grip!),
but, because she and I are focused on the examination of assumptions having
to do with a specific context, and because our evaluation is worthless (for
our purposes,) if it isn't practical and rooted in the actual context,
almost everything I know as a matter of supposed erudition is irrelevant.

(Funny thing is, great teacher that Judith is, she never told me my
intellectual elaborations were irrelevant, she just waited me out until I
had enough experience (years) of their irrelevance that the assumptions
which held them so important no longer had a reason to be held. We'd call
that a 'slow' technique!)

***

So, on one hand, for our *practical* purposes, 'game' doesn't have to have
an expansive meaning. After questioning my assumptions, I would, were I to
do it today, have presented the COC Game as The Circle of Connections
Un-Game. Why? Because this would shake things a bit more from the git go.

Obviously, it's all a bit paradoxical. No doubt the expansive meaning of
the word *game* is both valid and interesting in it's own right. My concern
is with it's connection with assumptions (on both sides,) in the actual
context of this particular game. As for cultural norms, I look for the
embedded assumptions; they are often kin to common norms, cultural or
otherwise.

So, Charles, your contribution of 'wiggle-room (etc.)' is wrong, right,
irrelevant, relevant, and, in the context of today, a ba-ba-bang
synchronicity. I'll follow up with details.

Hope you can live okay with that!

***

regards, Stephen

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 21:49:13 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Charles Cameron <hipbone@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] Game / Un-Game
In-Reply-To:  <v04220800b5a13bdb6b46@[207.54.160.215]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Stephen writes:

>Taken out of context this may or may not be true, Charles. But, since it
>specifically had a context, given that context, it is definitely not true.
[...]
>So, Charles, your contribution of 'wiggle-room (etc.)' is wrong, right,
>irrelevant, relevant, and, in the context of today, a ba-ba-bang
>synchronicity. I'll follow up with details.
>
>Hope you can live okay with that!

Absobloominglutely!  My love & respect to you both...


--
Charles
Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
*
Senior Analyst, The Arlington Institute <chasc@arlingtoninstitute.org>
HipBone Games http://home.earthlink.net/~hipbone

____________________________________________________________
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here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 20:34:52 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Assumptions
In-Reply-To:  <v04210114b5a11637e917@[207.54.160.223]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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all,

Today was a fantastic day to be wondering about games, assumptions,
context, intention, and practicality. After all, it was a gorgeous day and
my reflections on the COC Game were percolating. I read two newspapers,
watched the end of the British Open, tied up my tomatoes some more, and
read my email.

And got down to reflectin'.

***

Games.

Fifteen years ago I started coaching the Women's and Men's club volleyball
teams at Middlebury College. I did so for two years. As it happened, at the
end of the women's team's second season, they were invited as a last-minute
substitute to a tournament with three teams from much bigger schools. They
were crushed in four games.

The coach from Boston University came up to me after the last game and told
me,

"Your team has lots of raw talent, and they need a lot of work, but, I just
had to tell you, despite their long afternoon, they seemed to be having the
most fun of anybody out there."

I saw it a little differently, but I had developed the team to have fun, so
her observation was probably correct. I don't think they had as much fun as
she thought they were having, but, I was in a privileged position to know a
little better.

At the end of the season both teams I coached applied for varsity status. I
was invited to the athletic director's office, where I was told the
following:

"Even if you thought the department wasn't taking notice, we were, and we
noted the improvement of your teams and how much your players enjoy playing
for you. However, if we transition the clubs to varsity status we will seek
a new coach. I'm sure you understand why, but, above all, we want to
clarify the players' attitudes about the competitive nature of their sport."

I gave no argument because the AD was certainly right. I met with the
women's team. Right before they burst into tears, I managed to tell them
that their talent would thrive under a new coach in ways that it could not
under my direction.

One game; different assumptions.

***

Tiger Woods is a great golfer. The best ever? Probably, if you simply
evaluate the strength of his game. I was struck today, and perhaps some of
you also saw it, by the difference between the 'new school' of Tiger and
the 'old school' of playing partner David Duval on the 17th hole, the road
hole at St. Andrews.

On one hand, the implacable Woods took his bogie. His 'mantra', as the
newspapers report it: "I just try to be in the present." And then Duval:
assessing the odds and outcomes and proceeding to bury himself with a
quadruple bogie.

Because in the normal terms of sports, talent is assessed in 'measurebles',
it's not surprising to read of Tiger's amazing numbers. This assessment is
clear evidence of his superiority, but it doesn't explain it. And Tiger is
into the numbers too! And Tiger has a burning desire to win.

But, I'm not sure either factor is the full explanation. (I do know a lot
of newsprint is going to be expended in attempting to explain his
superiority using the working assumptions of 'sports'.)

Anyway, I got to thinking if it is possible that Tiger Woods holds his
intention differently than any other current golfer. "I just try to be in
the present." seems to be a clue. Is this what allows him not to be
distracted and shape his shots and manage the course like few before him
ever have? Who knows?

One game, different assumptions?

***

Then I thought about the difference between adept and inept teachers. Maybe
the issues of empathy and context and assumptions were a bit too numinous
for me today, yet I pondered what seemed to be true: the adept teacher
feeds practical assumptions with a great clarity of empathy for the actual
context, which, of course, includes the students.

Hmmmm. One game? Different assumptions?

***

best2all,

Stephen

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 23 Jul 2000 23:40:59 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Stephen Calhoun <hoon@APK.NET>
Subject:      [COC GAME] Staying
In-Reply-To:  <v04220800b5a13bdb6b46@[207.54.160.215]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

all,

The board sits in front of me. Some of you are literally half a world away.
But, you're here too. In a way you're all right here, now.

I have advantages, I suppose, in reflecting on this game. For one thing,
I've lived with it day in and day out for six weeks. I fashioned the board
from your kind contributions and have tried, with some slips, to be
attentive. The game has kind of attached itself to be. <-oops, left that
typo in.

Reflection? Now, reflection is easy for me. Quantity for sure;
quality...we'll see. I'm sure there is no right or wrong answer and
whatever I see is valuable is just what it is; not so much right but
reflected. I enjoy reflecting, projecting, making stuff up, pretending,
connecting.

***

It's a beautiful board. Not because it's pretty to look at, but because its
peopled by both the persons who made it, and Psyber-L, by the Psyber-L
crowd.

"Board" doesn't do it justice. It's more like a kind of aquarium for me.
It's stuff is swimming and exploring and breathing and is quite alive. All
of you.

***

Sure it's a bit idealized but the picture is not all light, all music, all
togetherness.

How lonely the two benches are! How abandoned the cliff dwellings are. How
stark does the sitar look without hands upon it? What does the pup howl
for? The chain link fence: you can't see my hands clench it.

***

Yes, Robert, everything is at the edges, and nothing is in the center.

Staying.

Staying with the peopled game without anything at the center. Staying.

***

Walter, 23 July, "it is sometimes a fear of mine that this whole space is
too dependent on me"

When you're not here how is it possible you are here? Because, even when
you stay away, you're here; how?

Judith, 23 July, "what I had to consciously do was to expand my space if
you will to encompass everyone"

"on an energetic level we unconsciously are aware of needing someone
holding the center"

Staying.

***

Anita, 21 July, "What  is going here?  I  downloaded the game  page and
the  messages,  but   still I  cannot understand."

Sheryl, 22 July, "*OH!  We all want the same thing!*"

Staying.

***

Robert, 19 Jun, subject: Janell ... yes please stay

Charles, 5 July, "My Seeking Spirit ... whose work I must hear ... Bliss
... a sitar gently weeps ..."

Staying.

***

Bent, 7 July

"Right now there is light in my lamp. and thank You for a great work. Its
beautiful. And Walter thank You for the response ,I`ll be back soon. dead
is a part of life but its a hard work."

Staying.

***

Janell, 7 June, "Yes, I'd like to play."

Robert, 10 july, "Looking outwards for a "harmony" (and I am taken again to
music which is an aural/oral action of creating/re-creating harmony) that
is longed for by the inner self."

Miles, 11 July, " how about we refine it a bit so we can all see that ?"

Greg, 15 July, " Perhaps I am used to playing different kinds of "games" -
a limitation on my part."

Staying.

***

Staying. Why do I feel like a lamp? Staying. What can I learn from this
group? Staying. What possibilities remain to be discovered? Staying. How do
I relate to the other participants? Staying. How subtle and rich can we
make it? Staying.

***

Sheryl, 22 July "what remains in my soul or psyche, that we all want the
same thing, we just aren't sure what it may be."

Judith, 4 July, "...it takes "real faith" for souls to express their
individual uniqueness, that it takes the work of staying in order to
mature, to have opportunity for rejuvenation, to find what possibilities
remain for discovery, for learning together...and the circle is asking this
of us, to find the way into the circle with our physicalness fenced out"

Staying.

Learning.

Staying.

***

A bountiful, deep snap shot we took. Great game. Everybody a winner; the
finish line...the goal.

Staying.

***

peace, appreciation, love to all,

Stephen


ps. all responses allowed! ;-)

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
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=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 24 Jul 2000 17:41:46 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      Games
In-Reply-To:  <l03130302b5a1331c419e@[63.20.83.53]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Charles, Judith, all

  Re: [P] [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
  Sun, 23 Jul 2000 19:41:46 -0400

Hi, I have changed the thread title to "Games" so we can have one
thread to continue the COC reflections and another for Games in
general, which i think of as important.

~~~

I am always super conscious of tensions like the feelings you
raised Judith, and i hope that Charles immediate response was
helpful.

~~~

The discussion about games bought up echoes of my language of
origin, Dutch, which is close to German, which I don't know.  The
Dutch word for a game is spel... [I dont know how to spell in
Dutch, but i think it is one l - as i grew up with the language
in oral form I do have a good sense of the feel of the words]
which is much closer, like in German, as you mentioned Charles,
to the word play, which in Dutch is speelen, the verb from the
noun. There is a link too with the theatre, where one plays a
role "een rol speelen"  and d while the word "toneel" is used for
theatre, I recall the use of "toneelspel" for a play.

I think the German original "Das Glasperlenspiel" for the "Glass
Bead Game" would have carried something of that theatrical depth
that the English word game does not, perhaps tending in the
direction of drama, as in Psychodrama.

~~~

Games and plays both have a way of being psychological via some
form of structure, they create a microcosm in which experience is
concentrated, reduced, highlighted to reveal what might otherwise
be hidden.  In this way psychotherapy, with its infinitely
flexible but definite family of rules is also a sort of
game-drama.

It is precisely because the HipBone Glass Bead Game, and our
current COC game as well, offer such structures that they allow a
psychological mode of work to be developed that is suitable to
the multimedia and the group nature of the net.

I think there is a difficulty with the word 'game' for depth
psychological work. Remember the book "Games People Play" by Eric
Berne - these games are not nice. Playing around, playing games
too easily points into a direction where it is easy to confuse
real dramas as games or false dramas, as in being a "dramaqueen".

I recall in my training as a group worker being taught not to use
the word "exercise" for a group activity... better to call it
just that, an activity, so that it does not take on the sense of
being a rehearsal, or a an experiment.

The HipBone Games (as used in the DreamEvents) and our current
Circle Game ... I tend to think of a structured psychological
activities or events.  I am sure we will use the word 'game', but
in the psychological context we can add plenty of descriptions
that avoid the complexity, and i think we have on this occasion!


Walter


______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 24 Jul 2000 19:10:34 +0300
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Anita Konkka <anitak@MEGABAUD.FI>
Subject:      Re: Back on the list
In-Reply-To:  <hghkns47i44lo326247dg1lq70a1thlgfq@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

Hi  all,

Walter asked:

>Was the project a success from a literature point of view?

One will have to see, when  a literary collection of   travelling  stories,
poems, essays  etc. will  come  out next  year.  105 writers have  engaged
by contract to write a text about  the journey.
    It  was  a success  as to for  the publicity.  In  every 19 cities we
have readings, symposiums, panel
discussions,  and  literature  festivals.   All those events generated high
media  attention  and  we have  much audience  everywhere.  Sometimes it
was  too strenuous to me to be  in the limelight all the time.  I had
readings in Lisbon, Madrid, Paris, Brussels, Tallinn and  Berlin,
and  Round table discussions in  Paris, Kaliningrad and
Berlin.  But  You  can  read more  about the  project on  the web, the
address is: http://www.literaturexpress.org

Stephen,

You wrote

>  I'd really like to know if you see anything interesting arise out of
>the interplay of stuff on the board.


I'll  try  to download the  board, and  look at it, but  not now.  I
have  so  much to do at home.   And it  takes  time to
digest  all  experiences. It was  so  an unique trip. I have never
been  in  such  a big group   for so a long time.  It
was  interesting  to  recognize  how   the  group consciousness
and  unconsciousness  were developing  on the  train., because we were so
tightly together.  It was not always  easy to
tell  which   are  the  group' s, and which my own  feelings and
emotions.  Also my dreams altered during the trip.  I saw more bad  dreams
in  Russia and Belo-Russia, because the  group consciousness  changed  more
dissonant there.  For  many  Western writers it  was  a cultural  shock to
be  in Russia  first time.  It not  to me, because I have been there so
many times, but  somehow I  took  their emotional state  into my dreams.

  Ooh Charles,
  it's long time  since  I  heard  you.  Nice to meet  again.  I think that
you know  lots of  word games. Maybe  you   know  also  something
about  Oulipo-group.  On the  train I  had   the
most  interesting  discussions with  a member of  Oulipo-group.  Subject
was:  the Oulipian word-games. They really  fascinated me.,  and  now I'm
reading  a book Oulipo Compendium, edited by Harry Mathews & Alastair
Brotchie ( Atlas Press, London 1998).

Best  to all
Anita














>Strangely I have a sense that travel is not really conducive to
>writing.  Maybe for some but not for me. The trip i have just
>been on grew out of Josh's graduation, and so was planned around
>that... Kate and i have been planning one for ourselves due in a
>few years time.  Right now I just dont know how to do that!  Kate
>likes to go sight seeing... I prefer sitting in cafes reading and
>writing.  One thought i had was renting a cheap place in europe
>somewhere as a base and I could just stay put.  Perhaps an
>exchange of homes with someone?  We have a nice home in central
>Christchurch and a holiday house in the hills!
>
> > And  now  I  try to return back  to  reality, back
> > to  everyday life.  It is so  hard.
>
>I feel the same.  It has taken a full week to feel half normal.
>That makes for a month of disorientation!
>
>~~~
>
> > What  is going here?  I  downloaded the game  page
> > and  the  messages,  but   still I  cannot understand.   Could, you
> > Stephen,  write a  short resume about  the game and its  stages?
>
>You may wish to explore the instructions on the web archives of
>this list.
>
>But on a thumbnail it is this:
>
>We each sent an image and a sentence to Stephen on the theme:
>"What is our wish for Psyber-L" Stephen made them up into a web
>page which was then revealed to all and we have been reflecting
>on the result.
>
>~~~
>
> > Welcome  Lurie Malai from Chisinau!
>
>Anita, I am glad you added your welcome!  It helps a lot I think
>to make this a place with energy if we attend to welcomes and
>initiatives from others.
>
>~~~
>
>I am back on the list too... though still conscious of being in
>reentry mode... I still have a swag of messages on the
>answerphone to attend to for example. We are in the midst of a
>very relaxing weekend in our holiday house, and listening to the
>music from the Insider - Music by Lisa Gerrard and Pieter Bourke.
>Often i dont like soundtracks but this one is great... I thought
>while watching the movie how much I liked the music!
>
>
>Another thing i have been doing more of lately, and can do more
>thoroughly now is online psychotherapy.  I have found the process
>really worthwhile recently.  Did i mention that i have a new URL
>for the purpose of strengthening that aspect of my work?
>http://www.psychotherapist.co.nz  There is nothing there apart
>from a link to the old pages, but this is a project i want to
>develop.  [PS: I am not offering online psychotherapy to members
>of this Psyber-L group... I see this more or less confidential
>space more as one where i can reflect on this work (without
>naming names of course) and I am clear about the boundary].
>
>Best wishes,
>
>
>Walter
>______________
>Walter Logeman
>walter@psybernet.co.nz
>http://www.psybernet.co.nz
>WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
>here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html
>

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 25 Jul 2000 09:43:18 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] REFLECTIONS
In-Reply-To:  <l03130302b5a1331c419e@[63.20.83.53]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

>Charles,

I've been spending much time considering my response to your
posting...first, I knowknew you were not being purposeful...there is
irony here because I was speaking about Stephen's need to consider
the "other" in terms of his teaching...and our exchange illustrated
this...you very much engaging from your place and interest and
assumptions...not a judgement merely an observation inthe context of
the emergence...18 months ago I would have engaged your contribution
from my "thinking" place...what I can report was that the response
was immediate  before I could engage my "thinking"...and that in
contemplation I have had to return to the "feeling" sense that was
evoked...thinking about it distances me somehow from the truth of it
from my beingness

so I continue to learn and am grateful for your openheartedness in my learning

Here is my place...I was surprised at my immediate response to your
posting...interestingly Stephen and I had a moment weeks ago where he
said something and my response was immediate and huge..in Stephen's
and my case, the wave we had been riding with our work collapsed as a
result...the collapse was spontaneous and a result of the space we
inhabited not big enug to hold who I am becoming...the crux of this
is that at a very fundamental (cellular) level I am not the same
person I was 18 months ago...this last illness seige took me to a
place where I was stripped of everything and everything was asked of
me..there was no way to "think" myself through the intensity and
enormity of the experience...the only way thru was to "feel" my way
through it, to engage my body...as a result, I am Nu-me and I don't
have much of a clue who that is as yet...beginner's mind truly...so
experiences where I have very deep, body centered responses are
perplexing...it is as if my body knows the entirety of the exchange
multidimensionally and my brain hasn't caught up as yet

The eruptions feel as if they come from the source of me somehow tho
I am want to have the words to describe the sensation...the response
seems to erupt out of a clarity...a place of "truth for me"

what I am in awe of is the seeming synchonicity of the contributions
to the game board which are about connection...

That said: what is interesting to me is that I of course am aware of
your passion for games and expertise but that awareness which in the
past would have been the basis of a response was taken out of my
control...I simply could not "think" my way out of my
response...truth for me was that in my response I experienced my
integrity in a rich new way...and I am being asked to be open to a
reformulating sense of authenticity...thank you for the gift

Warmly,
Judith


> > sorry, charles, but my reaction to your comments is that
>> I'm being patronized...
>
>This is the most important part of your post, for me, since reflects a
>"hurt" in the conversation -- so I'm pulling it to the top and dealing with
>it first.
>
>I never intended to patronize you, and I'm sorry if I seemed to: I quoted
>Wittgenstein because he's a fascinating thinker and book-friend, not to
>patronize.  After reading your posts here for several years, I tend to
>think of you in collegial terms, as a valued friend, certainly not someone
>I would wish to demean.  My apologies in any case.
>
>> All the games I know of (which addmittedly may be limited)
>> keep score tho chess gets to check mate, no scoring along
>> the way if you don't count taking men, and if keeping score
>> isn't about outcome, then why do games keep score...
>
>I think my point is probably the same as yours, Judith, as well as being
>opposite to it in some ways [as Oxford and Cambridge are opposites that are
>almost identical].  You're addressing your sense that the norm tends to
>exclude "play for the fun of it", I'm suggesting the norm can include it.
>Both of us want language to be used in a manner that's normative enough to
>facilitate mutual understanding.
>
>> just play for the fun of it, no score...
>
>The catch is what we think the word "game" (normally) means.  If you define
>games in such a way as to exclude "just play for the fun of it, no score",
>then you'll also be able to say "All the games I know of keep score"...
>whereas if you define games to include "just play for the fun of it, no
>score", you can say "I know games that keep score and games that don't".
>
>Noah Falstein, who was President of the Computer Game Developers
>Association at the time, wrote once:
>
>::  I am prompted to comment that there are two general
>::  classifications of game playing, playing in order to win
>::  (competitively) and playing for the sheer joy of play.
>
>I think that's a clear enough indication both that playing to win is the
>most usual meaning (basically your position), and also that playing for
>sheer joy is also part of the norm (basically mine).   My own HipBone
>Games, in fact, are designed *specifically* so that you can keep score
>[competitive play], pretend to keep score [mock-competitive play with
>cooperative intent, which turns out to be hilarious] or not keep score
>[collaborative and aesthetic play].
>
>> I never said Stephen was "wrong" just that he was
>> making assumptions which were unexamined...
>
>I'm suggesting this might fall under the rubric of "slighly different
>senses of what the word normally means" rather than "unexamined
>assumptions"...
>
>*
>
>However, whichever way we see it, to me the fascinating point is that
>Wittgenstein -- one of the most brilliant minds of the last century --
>found the word "game" and its meanings so extraordinarily hard to capture
>under a single definition that he used it as his example of fluidity in the
>meaning of words.  For myself as a game designer, one time editor-at-large
>of a game developer's magazine, and person who is still hoping to write a
>book about games and play and how they're at the heart of creativity one of
>these days, that's a big deal... and one that I wanted to share with you.
>It's what I think of as a "beloved fact", I collect such things, and I'm
>offering it as a gift.
>
>Hoping my first para has straightened out any problems, and that we're on
>good terms again even if seeing things from different perspectives
>(something to rejoice in, I believe),
>
>Regards,
>
>--
>Charles
>Charles Cameron <hipbone@earthlink.net>
>*
>Senior Analyst, The Arlington Institute <chasc@arlingtoninstitute.org>
>HipBone Games http://home.earthlink.net/~hipbone
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
>here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 25 Jul 2000 15:56:01 -0700
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         JB <judithb@APK.NET>
Subject:      Re: Back on the list
In-Reply-To:  <4.3.1.0.20000724165252.00a79480@megabaud.fi>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

>Anita,

What a fabulous experience...thanks for sharing the web site and as
always your insights...we missed your presence

Blessings,
Judith

>
>Walter asked:
>
>>Was the project a success from a literature point of view?
>
>One will have to see, when  a literary collection of   travelling  stories,
>poems, essays  etc. will  come  out next  year.  105 writers have  engaged
>by contract to write a text about  the journey.
>   It  was  a success  as to for  the publicity.  In  every 19 cities we
>have readings, symposiums, panel
>discussions,  and  literature  festivals.   All those events generated high
>media  attention  and  we have  much audience  everywhere.  Sometimes it
>was  too strenuous to me to be  in the limelight all the time.  I had
>readings in Lisbon, Madrid, Paris, Brussels, Tallinn and  Berlin,
>and  Round table discussions in  Paris, Kaliningrad and
>Berlin.  But  You  can  read more  about the  project on  the web, the
>address is: http://www.literaturexpress.org
>
>Stephen,
>
>You wrote
>
>>I'd really like to know if you see anything interesting arise out of
>>the interplay of stuff on the board.
>
>
>I'll  try  to download the  board, and  look at it, but  not now.  I
>have  so  much to do at home.   And it  takes  time to
>digest  all  experiences. It was  so  an unique trip. I have never
>been  in  such  a big group   for so a long time.  It
>was  interesting  to  recognize  how   the  group consciousness
>and  unconsciousness  were developing  on the  train., because we were so
>tightly together.  It was not always  easy to
>tell  which   are  the  group' s, and which my own  feelings and
>emotions.  Also my dreams altered during the trip.  I saw more bad  dreams
>in  Russia and Belo-Russia, because the  group consciousness  changed  more
>dissonant there.  For  many  Western writers it  was  a cultural  shock to
>be  in Russia  first time.  It not  to me, because I have been there so
>many times, but  somehow I  took  their emotional state  into my dreams.
>
> Ooh Charles,
> it's long time  since  I  heard  you.  Nice to meet  again.  I think that
>you know  lots of  word games. Maybe  you   know  also  something
>about  Oulipo-group.  On the  train I  had   the
>most  interesting  discussions with  a member of  Oulipo-group.  Subject
>was:  the Oulipian word-games. They really  fascinated me.,  and  now I'm
>reading  a book Oulipo Compendium, edited by Harry Mathews & Alastair
>Brotchie ( Atlas Press, London 1998).
>
>Best  to all
>Anita
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>Strangely I have a sense that travel is not really conducive to
>>writing.  Maybe for some but not for me. The trip i have just
>>been on grew out of Josh's graduation, and so was planned around
>>that... Kate and i have been planning one for ourselves due in a
>>few years time.  Right now I just dont know how to do that!  Kate
>>likes to go sight seeing... I prefer sitting in cafes reading and
>>writing.  One thought i had was renting a cheap place in europe
>>somewhere as a base and I could just stay put.  Perhaps an
>>exchange of homes with someone?  We have a nice home in central
>>Christchurch and a holiday house in the hills!
>>
>>> And  now  I  try to return back  to  reality, back
>>> to  everyday life.  It is so  hard.
>>
>>I feel the same.  It has taken a full week to feel half normal.
>>That makes for a month of disorientation!
>>
>>~~~
>>
>>> What  is going here?  I  downloaded the game  page
>>> and  the  messages,  but   still I  cannot understand.   Could, you
>>> Stephen,  write a  short resume about  the game and its  stages?
>>
>>You may wish to explore the instructions on the web archives of
>>this list.
>>
>>But on a thumbnail it is this:
>>
>>We each sent an image and a sentence to Stephen on the theme:
>>"What is our wish for Psyber-L" Stephen made them up into a web
>>page which was then revealed to all and we have been reflecting
>>on the result.
>>
>>~~~
>>
>>> Welcome  Lurie Malai from Chisinau!
>>
>>Anita, I am glad you added your welcome!  It helps a lot I think
>>to make this a place with energy if we attend to welcomes and
>>initiatives from others.
>>
>>~~~
>>
>>I am back on the list too... though still conscious of being in
>>reentry mode... I still have a swag of messages on the
>>answerphone to attend to for example. We are in the midst of a
>>very relaxing weekend in our holiday house, and listening to the
>>music from the Insider - Music by Lisa Gerrard and Pieter Bourke.
>>Often i dont like soundtracks but this one is great... I thought
>>while watching the movie how much I liked the music!
>>
>>
>>Another thing i have been doing more of lately, and can do more
>>thoroughly now is online psychotherapy.  I have found the process
>>really worthwhile recently.  Did i mention that i have a new URL
>>for the purpose of strengthening that aspect of my work?
>>http://www.psychotherapist.co.nz  There is nothing there apart
>>from a link to the old pages, but this is a project i want to
>>develop.  [PS: I am not offering online psychotherapy to members
>>of this Psyber-L group... I see this more or less confidential
>>space more as one where i can reflect on this work (without
>>naming names of course) and I am clear about the boundary].
>>
>>Best wishes,
>>
>>
>>Walter
>>______________
>>Walter Logeman
>>walter@psybernet.co.nz
>>http://www.psybernet.co.nz
>>WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com
>>
>>____________________________________________________________
>>Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
>>here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html
>>
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
>here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 26 Jul 2000 01:06:00 +0300
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Anita Konkka <anitak@MEGABAUD.FI>
Subject:      Re: [COC GAME] Saturday Update; Anita, Iurie
In-Reply-To:  <v04220800b5a0097bd652@[207.54.160.121]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

Stephen,

You  wrote:

>Anita I'd really like to know if you see anything interesting arise out of
>the interplay of stuff on the board.


I  downloaded  the  game board anew and looked at the  deep  blue  circle.
First  I saw
a  flower named Morning  glory ( Imopea purpurea) which  is  blooming  in
my son's  garden. Then I saw  space and  figures  dancing around
the  center, like  star constellations moving   around  the
sun.  And  the  center  there  was  not a void,  but  an oneness
from  which   9 rays were  radiating   toward the  edges  of
the  circle.  I think,there  is unity through diversity  It  is not always
easy  to understand and recognize.
    There  are  some  disturbing  pictures and  questions on  the  edge of
the circle.  I  react  strongly to  the  net  fence  and  the question: "
How do I  relate to  the other participants? "  I  stopped to think how
I  generally relate to people. After  having  meditated the fence- picture,
I think that  the  fence is  not   so bad,  somehow I  need it, as  I  need
much  space around me
There  is  always been a  fence- it is   my  reservedness.  It  was a
problem, when I  was  young,  but  not nowadays,  because  I  can  relate
to people   through  the written words.   And sometimes  even  through
the  spoken words.   Somehow people are  no more as  frightening  as they
were in  my youth.  They  have  miraculously  changed for the better.
     But  how   do I relate in Psyber-L?  I  feel  that  this list is
like  a old friend  we  have common  interests and experiences,  we  know
each other very well, but  don't
meet  often.  Sometimes  I  write,  sometimes I have no time to write.

Regards
Anita

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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 26 Jul 2000 23:03:20 +1200
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Organization: psybernet
Subject:      DreamEvent Article
Comments: To: josh@zesty.com, bonaanna@hotmail.com,
          group-l@lists.groupsense.co.nz, kate@psybernet.co.nz,
          isabella.cooper@paradise.net.nz
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi All,

The article i wrote on the DreamEvents is now online:

http://www.geocities.com/asdreams_2000/cyberdreams/lodgeman.htm#top

I hope i give an inkling of what it is like, as well as provide a
resource for future events.

Best wishes,

Walter
______________
Walter Logeman
walter@psybernet.co.nz
http://www.psybernet.co.nz
WebLog: http://psybernet.editthispage.com

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=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 26 Jul 2000 23:17:56 +0300
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Anita Konkka <anitak@MEGABAUD.FI>
Subject:      Re: DreamEvent Article
In-Reply-To:  <o3htns0sqpa86kb9dda3ctl569km8emfle@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

Hi Walter,

Thank you for the  link  of  the DreamEvent. I red it. A really interesting
article!  I'm  so sorry that I couldn't   participate  in the
second  DreamEvent.  Perhaps the  next time.

Waiting for t the future  event
Anita

At 23:03 26.7.2000 +1200, you wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>The article i wrote on the DreamEvents is now online:
>
>http://www.geocities.com/asdreams_2000/cyberdreams/lodgeman.htm#top

____________________________________________________________
Read, write in Psyber-L, manage your options, or unsubscribe
here:      http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/psyber-l.html


=========================================================================
Date:         Fri, 28 Jul 2000 01:34:18 -0400
Reply-To:     Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
Sender:       Exploring the Psyche in Cyberspace <PSYBER-L@HOME.EASE.LSOFT.COM>
From:         Walter Logeman <walter@PSYBERNET.CO.NZ>
Subject:      Re: DreamEvent Article

Anita,

>Thank you for the  link  of  the DreamEvent. I red it. A really interesting
>article!  I'm  so sorry that I couldn't   participate  in the
>second  DreamEvent.  Perhaps the  next time.
>
>Waiting for t the future  event

Thanks Anita.  Future events! Now there is an Idea :)

I have been ispired buy the COC game, the idea of "short and sweet" was
good, and worked well.  Stephen, it might not have been so short and sweet
for youy, but as a participant it has felt more like a gift and less *hard
work* than the groups... I do love groups - I'm here, but they can be such
work!


Walter

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